Is it really worth going to Window 10 from Windows 7

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raglafart

raglafart

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Everything I read about Windows 10 makes me wary of trying to use it again.
When it first came out it corrupted everything on my drive and caused major boot issues.

I'm running Win 7 pro 64 bit currently and it works fine. I realize that sooner or later I'm going to have to upgrade and also do that to my wife's machine.
I've just bought a couple of licenses and down loaded the latest ISO to a USB stick and was going to do a clean install on a virgin Samsung Evo 860 500 ssd but then found an article about how the latest 2018 April updates are crashing SSD systems.

I hate the look of Win 10 and was going to use all the 3rd party downloads to make it look and feel like 7.

Any advice would be appreciated. I worry about the spying and update philosophy of 10

Cheers JG
 
I've been dual-booting Windows 7 and Windows 10 since Windows 10's release. I haven't found anything that I can't do in Windows 7 but can do in Windows 10. Though, I find that there is a lot more control, stability, and reliability in Windows 7. There's also more privacy, and even more security, if comparing how many new overall and serious vulnerabilities are discovered in each OS per month (there are significantly fewer for Windows 7).

If you like Windows 7 and don't like Windows 10, then don't swap OSes. There really isn't a reason to.
 
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No, it's not worth it but only you can judge that for yourself - nobody else, especially not people around here, can tell you otherwise. If you must, image your current installation, make a perfect bit-for-bit image of the entire system partition and save it someplace so you can restore if needed and then install Windows 10 and see what happens. If you're interested you can even install the Windows 10 Enterprise trial version (not LTSB) and play with that in a virtual machine using VirtualBox or VMware Player and be able to get rid of it entirely without it affecting your current installation at all in any manner.

So that answer from me, "No, it's not worth it," is my personal opinion given there's nothing that Windows 10 brings to the table that is of any use to me personally - Windows 7 does everything I require, faster, better, more efficiently, but that is just my own opinion based on my own working experience with it.
 
ok i made this move. Featurewise.. pointless for me. Driver latency went up and continue to have DPC issues on Win10 where as Win7 had no issues. Nice to be in a 3d firefight and your sound driver begins looping and your video freezes. Lost all of the AI Suite tools, have to go 3rd party. It's all about the drivers really. My advice is to stay win7.
 
Hold onto that "works fine" part. You know the adage if it isn't broken don't fix it. If you need features like monitor independent DPI scaling, go for it otherwise ride that thing for as long as you wish.
 
Delicieuxz said:
I've been dual-booting Windows 7 and Windows 10 since Windows 10's release. I haven't found anything that I can't do in Windows 7 but can do in Windows 10. Though, I find that there is a lot more control, stability, and reliability in Windows 7. There's also more privacy, and even more security, if comparing how many new overall and serious vulnerabilities are discovered in each OS per month (there are significantly fewer for Windows 7).

If you like Windows 7 and don't like Windows 10, then don't swap OSes. There really isn't a reason to.
Click to expand...

I haven't found anything that I can't do in Windows 10 but can do in Windows 7. Though, I find that there is a lot more control, stability, and reliability in Windows 10. There's also more "privacy", and even more security, if comparing how many new overall and serious vulnerabilities are discovered in each OS per month (there are significantly fewer for Windows 10).
 
I went from Win10 to Win7 and found myself happier. I didn't have to worry about twice a year reimages of my machine anymore. I didn't have to worry about MS neutering the features of 10 Pro to make it more like 10 Home anymore. I don't have to worry about the non-removable spying anymore. I didn't have to worry about that worthless bitch Cortana anymore. I didn't have to look at the flat, dull and everything looks the exact same UI anymore.

I'm sure there are more reasons why I'm happier having swapped from 10 to 7 but I think that list is enough for now.
 
This one is difficult. Because the answer is "no", but eventually you'll have to move anyway. Just the way of the Windows. Now... it's possible that there will be a Microsoft UltraOS release at some point... it's just that Microsoft sort of promised that "Windows 10" would be "it".
 
Bottom Line is that windows 10 is just a way to get MS to suck you into their cloud. See Apple/AppleID, the masters of data ownage along with FakeBook.
 
Stoly said:
I haven't found anything that I can't do in Windows 10 but can do in Windows 7. Though, I find that there is a lot more control, stability, and reliability in Windows 10. There's also more "privacy", and even more security, if comparing how many new overall and serious vulnerabilities are discovered in each OS per month (there are significantly fewer for Windows 10).
Click to expand...

Except your reversal of what I've said is literally not true.

There is literally more stability in Windows 7 than in Windows 10.

There is literally more control in Windows 7 than in Windows 10.

There is literally more reliability in Windows 7 than in Windows 10 (with Windows 10 having poor QA bi-annual updates, settings resetting, the system resetting on its own...).

There is literally more privacy by default in Windows 7 than in Windows 10.

There are literally fewer new security vulnerabilities per month in Windows 7 than in Windows 10:


https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerab..._id-32238/year-2017/Microsoft-Windows-10.html
https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerab...t_id-17153/year-2017/Microsoft-Windows-7.html

In 2016: Windows 10 had 172 discovered vulnerabilities, compared to 134 in Windows 7.
In 2017: Windows 10 had 268 discovered vulnerabilities, compared to 229 in Windows 7.

Since August 2015, 95 most-sever (>= 9) vulnerabilities have been discovered in Windows 10 = ~35 most-severe vulnerabilities per year.
Since January 2010, 232 most-severe (>= 9) vulnerabilities have been discovered in Windows 7 = ~28 most-severe vulnerabilities per year.

Windows 10 is literally the least-secure Windows OS to-date.


Windows 10 is basically a downgraded version of Windows 7 that's designed to hook people into Microsoft's data-harvesting farm and to push people to spend money on Microsoft's integrated services. It's clearly a for-Microsoft OS at the expense of the system owner.
 
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Delicieuxz said:
There is literally more stability in Windows 7 than in Windows 10.
Click to expand...

How do you prove this across all devices that can run Windows though? I seriously doubt that Windows 7 would show more stability on my sig rig than Windows 10 has for the last two years. Windows 7 isn't going to show more reliability when dealing with 4k screens.

​
Delicieuxz said:
There is literally more control in Windows 7 than in Windows 10.
​
Click to expand...


The cumulative updating model did remove a lot of the control you get through individual updates, especially for Home users. There are issues with this model no doubt. There are also issues with the Windows 7 model where people never updated. This is one is difficult. But continuous deliver of incremental updates is the name of the game for all major consumer facing OSes these days. ​


​
Delicieuxz said:
There are literally fewer new security vulnerabilities per month in Windows 7 than in Windows 10:


https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerab..._id-32238/year-2017/Microsoft-Windows-10.html
https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerab...t_id-17153/year-2017/Microsoft-Windows-7.html

In 2016: Windows 10 had 172 discovered vulnerabilities, compared to 134 in Windows 7.
In 2017: Windows 10 had 268 discovered vulnerabilities, compared to 229 in Windows 7.
Click to expand...

A lot of Windows 10 issues involve features like Hyper-V which aren't present in Windows 7 and something typical users aren't gong to run. The large majority here though apply to all because they attack that long and complex history of Win32 code.
 
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I gave windows 1 a little more than a year. to try out
its going to be a long time until i give it another try.
Windows 7 just operates more smoothly and with less clicks to get things done.
 
Thanks everyone. I was wary about going to 10 and you've all confirmed it's not a big enough improvement to make it worth while.
Cheers JG
 
At some point, we will say goodbye to Windows 7, just like we did with Windows XP.

Funny thing, I still use Windows Media Center.

You don't have to choose. Install a mobile drive rack, pop in the drive with OS that you want.

The question is what can one do in Windows 10 that one cannot do in Windows 7. Corporations on Windows 7 are planning migration to Windows 10.

The most recent update 1803 has issues with Intel SSD 600 series. I would have been annoyed if it was borked on Intel 520.
 
It's an OS, do it or do not do it, it really is that simple. This is not life or death and although I appreciate you feeling comfortable asking us all for our opinion, use whatever you like to use and makes you happy. However, eventually, you will need to upgrade, at least if you want to continue receiving security updates, past April of 2020.

I noticed you already made your choice but, I am going to go ahead and post this anyways. (No need to be wary about anything like this though, as long as you have a good backup.)
 
I suppose the hope is that between now and April 2020 they will finally come up with the stable platform everyone was expecting with Win 10 when it was initially released.
I was prepared to go along with using 3rd party apps to make 10 look and feel like 7. I can hold off for now though as Win 7 is handling everything I need.
Thanks again everyone for your help.
Cheers JG
 
raglafart said:
I suppose the hope is that between now and April 2020 they will finally come up with the stable platform everyone was expecting with Win 10 when it was initially released.
Click to expand...

Actually the date of Windows 7 end of support is January 14, 2020, only 19 months away. I would suspect that date will get an extension or two, especially depending on the state of enterprise upgrades in the next year. But I doubt it's going to be like Windows XP that got extended for a lot of years.

We'll see what happens, I don't expect radical changes in how Windows 10 is delivered, it'll stay on incremental updates and continuous delivery, that's industry standard across commercial and open source development. They might go to one a year or come up with better delay options, but they aren't going back to 3 year big bang release cycles.
 
I’ve been waiting for Windows 10 to grow on me since the day it was released. For About 2 years I used it alongside 7, never much missing it while I was on the Win7 PCs. In mid 2017 I switched all of my systems to 10 and used it exclusively for 6 months. Eventually I reinstalled 7, thinking that it would feel dated and inferior, but it was like a breath of fresh air. 7 feels like a finished product, much more polished. 10 still feels like a work in progress to me.

7 is more predictable. I hate 10’s disruptive build updates.

I hate the nags, the attempts to trick me into using an online account, the hoop-jumping I must engage in to have control over Windows and driver updates, the mysterious processes that suddenly start hammering my crappy ADSL internet connection with no explanation, and the bi-polar control panel system. Windows 7 is more stable and reliable. For example, after this latest build one of my Windows 10 systems makes all the USB ports unresponsive in approx 1 in 10 boots. It has also hung on the shutting down screen indefinitely, requiring a hard reset. One of my work laptops also hung on that screen for several hours inexplicably. These were fast, modern, Win10-era systems. I don’t have to deal with any of that on 7.
 
I haven't had much problems at all with Windows 10 actually - but I've seen a lot of people that do.

I'm lucky to not to have to use Windows (any version) regularly so I don't get the problems. I boot up Windows10 once a week or two weeks to play a couple of hours of games and thats it. I've been extremely happy with Windows 10, mainly the part that I don't have to use it :D
 
Biggest problem I have is that every "seasonal update" is whole new OS. It wipes out settings, introduces incompatibilities and quite often, removes features. In other words today's 10 is very different from tomorrow's 10. While there have been radical updates in Microsoft's past, this is actually a new and regular practice with 10.
 
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cjcox said:
Biggest problem I have is that every "seasonal update" is whole new OS. It wipes out settings, introduces incompatibilities and quite often, removes features. In other words today's 10 is very different from tomorrow's 10. While there have been radical updates in Microsoft's past, this is actually a new and regular practice with 10.
Click to expand...
If you are doing a clean it will set settings to their default. I take the update path and my settings are not reset. Are you clean installing or updating?
 
Chuklr said:
If you are doing a clean it will set settings to their default. I take the update path and my settings are not reset. Are you clean installing or updating?
Click to expand...

I work at a company where we remove "the junk" from Windows 10. It all comes back after their "update". That's my point. Used not be this bad.
 
cjcox said:
I work at a company where we remove "the junk" from Windows 10. It all comes back after their "update". That's my point. Used not be this bad.
Click to expand...
I see. Good luck and I hope your work place finds a solution.
 
I too have seen "junk" come back after updates and occasionally have to reset sound from Stereo back to 5.1. I assume Microsoft will get better with this. I hope they eventually give more control of updating back in our hands, it's gotten more than a little ridiculous. If those issues are what's holding some back, I get it. Otherwise, I can do everything I could do with Windows 7. It's just as stable. Windows 7 rarely crashed, Windows 10 rarely crashes, though it does auto-restart after updates install.
 
My experience:

I switched to Windows 10 on my personal machine as soon as possible, and haven't missed windows 7 at all. While not perfect, I absolutely prefer the customizable start menu of 10 over windows 7 (I may be a minority, but IMO the worst iteration of the start menu since its introduction in 1995). I have benchmarked on my machine noticeable improvements using DX12 over DX11 on the games I have that use both. Hyper-V is a nice feature, and for the VM's I'm using, is way better than virtual box.

I haven't had any problems with updates breaking anything, but I have pretty common and relatively recent hardware.

Downsides for me is primarily the scattered nature of the configuration tools. Everything is still there, but have to get to different places for different stuff. After using Windows 10 exlusively at home for the last few years, and at work for the last several months, I actually have more problem finding the setting now in Windows 7!

It is a slight annoyance to set up the first time to use local accounts, but the one time I used a Microsoft account, it really didn't make much of a difference, and that computer wasn't even regularly connected to the Internet! After setting up the first account as a local account, it now defaults to local accounts.

Personally, I see no reason not to switch to Windows 10, but I always say that a computer is a tool, so use what works for you!
 
Fix Me said:
I too have seen "junk" come back after updates and occasionally have to reset sound from Stereo back to 5.1. I assume Microsoft will get better with this. I hope they eventually give more control of updating back in our hands, it's gotten more than a little ridiculous. If those issues are what's holding some back, I get it. Otherwise, I can do everything I could do with Windows 7. It's just as stable. Windows 7 rarely crashed, Windows 10 rarely crashes, though it does auto-restart after updates install.
Click to expand...

Some things we can handle with GPOs and scripts, but other things we have to do manually..... sigh...
 
Chuklr said:
If you are doing a clean it will set settings to their default. I take the update path and my settings are not reset. Are you clean installing or updating?
Click to expand...

Several types of settings are still reset with in-place build updates. For example: the Device Installation Settings checkbox, Advanced Network Settings (control panel), and disabled services. It is getting better slowly, because things like Start menu ad spam and default programs are no longer reset, but there’s still enough for it to be annoying
 
I don't use use windows 10 daily yet, it is on my second multimedia pc. Has 10 improved regarding of changing default file associations back to its own? I remember getting so tired after installing Irfanview picture manager to find out windows 10 does not honor new file associations set with Irfanview. Or VLC. Also I just recently found out that build in windows 10 interpretation of Skype does not support Full Screen?!! I mean, wtf, who wants to talk with other persons windowed in frame when 99% of time we want to max out our video screens for most pleasent user experience, who's brilliant idea it was in MS programmers team? Do they watch movies windowed to with nice gray bars on top and bottom of the screen? Also I found it harder to start a video call because all of that graphical improvement(?) in win10 Skype your contacts are gone into some sub sub menu screens??? If it was some struggle for me to find a contact to call using logical common sense (and I use pc everyday), how hard it is going to be on older people, hard to imagine. In classic Skype you just open main window and here are your contacts list - nice and clean view, you pick a contact, press video call icon, double tap for full screen and you're done. Not in Windows 10 modern Skype version. Going back to Classic.
 
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akmens said:
I don't use use windows 10 daily yet, it is on my second multimedia pc. Has 10 improved regarding of changing default file associations back to its own?
Click to expand...

For irfanview you need to install it and set the associations during the installation. They will immediately be reset with that stupid “an app is causing problems with file associations” message, but now you can go into Windows "default apps" and set irfanview as the default image viewer. After that it should work. From then on, don’t try to set associations via irfanview because they will always be rest. Set them using the Windows "choose default apps by file type" option. You just have to set them via irfanview the first time because otherwise it won’t appear in the Windows "default apps" list.

Also, the resetting of file associations after build updates appears to have been fixed (as mentioned above).
 
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I installed the Win10 preview to all our gaming computers with the false hope of DX12 bringing anything to the table. As it turns out it was 100% hype and 0 delivery.
The positive side was that even the computers and virtual machines that had no previous windows on them got granted a free Win10 installation. So I can't really complain myself - but I understand the agony of those poor ones who paid for it and do not know how to use anything else.
 
I actually liked the first version of windows 10 they released... but with every update they either remove stuff, or add extra bloat that I have no use or need for. It's really annoying to have all these forced additions, apps, or whatever they are. I'll never use them, they just take up space, and I wish for a lean, stripped down windows 10.
 
illli said:
I actually liked the first version of windows 10 they released... but with every update they either remove stuff, or add extra bloat that I have no use or need for. It's really annoying to have all these forced additions, apps, or whatever they are. I'll never use them, they just take up space, and I wish for a lean, stripped down windows 10.
Click to expand...

Get a licence for LTSB. Literally none of the bloat. Theres a few people on this forum selling licenses for cheap.
 
I would say no. For me I had to because Daz Studio was just getting too stupid on W7, but if nothing's pushing you, don't leave 7. 10 is a pain in the ass, with a special nod going to Windows Update, which arrogantly restarts your computer without your permission, gives you almost no control, etc.

Wait, I forgot the goddamned notifications. They're annoying as Hell. I haven't even researched if there's a way to disable them yet, let's hope so...
 
heatlesssun said:
How do you prove this across all devices that can run Windows though? I seriously doubt that Windows 7 would show more stability on my sig rig than Windows 10 has for the last two years. Windows 7 isn't going to show more reliability when dealing with 4k screens.




The cumulative updating model did remove a lot of the control you get through individual updates, especially for Home users. There are issues with this model no doubt. There are also issues with the Windows 7 model where people never updated. This is one is difficult. But continuous deliver of incremental updates is the name of the game for all major consumer facing OSes these days. ​


​

A lot of Windows 10 issues involve features like Hyper-V which aren't present in Windows 7 and something typical users aren't gong to run. The large majority here though apply to all because they attack that long and complex history of Win32 code.
Click to expand...
He doesn't have to. All it has to do is be more stable, reliable, etc., for him.
 
Chuklr said:
If you are doing a clean it will set settings to their default. I take the update path and my settings are not reset. Are you clean installing or updating?
Click to expand...
No, in my experience he's right. I just got the 18xx update like everyone else, and after the reboot I didn't authorize, all my little tweaks were wiped out. Crap like the stupid double-entries for drives in the Windows Explorer tree that I wisely removed and MS stupidly restored.
 
It is a slight annoyance to set up the first time to use local accounts, but the one time I used a Microsoft account, it really didn't make much of a difference, and that computer wasn't even regularly connected to the Internet! After setting up the first account as a local account, it now defaults to local accounts.
Personally, I see no reason not to switch to Windows 10, but I always say that a computer is a tool, so use what works for you!
Click to expand...
I've got a pretty great Microsoft account story. Patriots were gonna play in the SB, year, two years ago, can't remember. Anyway, I had W7 on my machine at home, and W10 on my laptop. I had a super-crappy internet connection, and I haven't had cable or even a TV antenna in years, but I decided I wanted to watch the game at my sister's house, because I ran a web search that said I could watch the game online for free if I did bla bla ba.

So, I got there AN HOUR EARLY because I'd seen that you needed a MS account to make this happen, and I know what a clusterfuck MS is, so I was like "hahaha bitch you're not gonna fuck up my game." It took me like 45 minutes, dicking around with all the crap I had to do, and I wound up missing the first few minutes of the game. Point being, MS will find new depths to fail to.

But that's not even the story. The story is that the shitbirds at MS actually took the account that I created and made it into the password on my laptop, without asking me. I shit you not. Keep in mind, I only created the account to use the once and I was done with it after that, as far as I was concerned. I didn't write the password down, and probably wouldn't have even if I knew WTF my sister kept her pens.
So now, next time I reboot, I've got a login staring me in the face. Suddenly I've got a laptop that I can't sign into because guess what, Microshit decided to just slide a password onto it. Holy shit, I was pissed. I don't think I've ever been that pissed about a technical SNAFU in my entire life. I'm glad I didn't have a coronary. That pretty much killed any live and let live sentiments I had left toward Micropenis.

(Yeah, eventually I got it all sorted out. No, I don't remember what all I had to do. I don't think it wound up being as bad as I expected...I dimly recall getting lucky with some aspect of the SNAFU and kinda side-stepping it)

Oh, and to top it all off, I left at halftime because the Pats were getting their asses kicked so hard. That's right, you guessed it...that was the year they had the greatest comeback in the history of the playoffs...in the second half.
 
Morlock said:
He doesn't have to. All it has to do is be more stable, reliable, etc., for him.
Click to expand...

And I completely understand that. I have enough personally invested in PC hardware and it would be silly for me to not run the OS that's best for that hardware. Windows 7 is pointless on 2 in 1s today and trying to run it on 4k monitors mixed with 1080p monitors is pretty much impossible.
 
Windows 10 is the better OS, but it also represents the transition to the modern way of doing things. That means a facebook/google style of data collection. Cloud bullshit pushed in your face way too much. Microsoft now assumes people are too dumb to deal with things like Windows updates and hardware drivers on their own (sad thing is they are probably correct), so they have adopted a much more aggressive style of updates where they are now in many cases installed in the background without even asking you anymore, where in some cases it's difficult for you to stop them from installing even if you don't want them to.

It can be frustrating dealing with things getting pushed on you when you don't want them. Then again, going back to 7 after being on 10 for a long time, that is when you really notice how much 10 has improved things. You can't stay on 7 forever, and ultimately it's not that hard to work around the annoyances in 10.
 
GotNoRice said:
Windows 10 is the better OS, but it also represents the transition to the modern way of doing things. That means a facebook/google style of data collection. Cloud bullshit pushed in your face way too much. Microsoft now assumes people are too dumb to deal with things like Windows updates and hardware drivers on their own (sad thing is they are probably correct), so they have adopted a much more aggressive style of updates where they are now in many cases installed in the background without even asking you anymore, where in some cases it's difficult for you to stop them from installing even if you don't want them to.

It can be frustrating dealing with things getting pushed on you when you don't want them. Then again, going back to 7 after being on 10 for a long time, that is when you really notice how much 10 has improved things. You can't stay on 7 forever, and ultimately it's not that hard to work around the annoyances in 10.
Click to expand...

This is precisely how I feel. I sit and wonder what it would be like if I could go back to Windows XP. When the operating system was just the operating system. It didn't try to be a personal assistant. It didn't try and push "apps" on you. It didn't try to get you to use cloud services. It was just an operating system. If you wanted functionality out of it, you could install software that would enable that functionality. It feels like Windows 10 is just a platform that Microsoft uses to advertise and entice you into their services. Office 365, apps from the app store that they get a huge cut on, Azure services, free microsoft accounts that tie everything together into a nice ball of telemetry data that advertisers cream their pants over. Even on the enterprise and business side. The Pro sku that most businesses use have the same bullshit that the home sku has, only you can join a domain and use hyper-v. I wish Microsoft would just go back to making a regular operating system and not try and turn your computer into a "device".
 
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