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Yeah, and that's fine. I want to hear all opinions - what you don't like or would change, etc. It's all useful information that helps me to make decisions on how to proceed.I much prefer the original design to be honest
So move the break line up to where the bend is? Yeah I thought about that, but if you do that you lose the bend radius, and the line of the panels doesn't flow smoothly anymore. Breaking the panels mid-surface preserves that continuity better.
Don't forget this only supports short cards (<215mm), which are probably a lot less likely to offer internal HDMI due to lack of board space.
I did try something that was more like the cutout on the M1, but it didn't look that good.
Don't forget this only supports short cards (<215mm), which are probably a lot less likely to offer internal HDMI due to lack of board space.
See how with the break on the bend there's no radius so the line doesn't flow as smoothly:Can't say I understand what you mean by this, could you perhaps illustrate with a render? I think the current location of the break line, i.e. in the middle, looks off and strange.
- On exterior design, I think what gives the M1 its unique look or its "face" is the front I/O cutout (in addition to the angled front). Would it be too crazy if you implemented the same/similar angular cutout for the front I/O of this case? It wouldn't be symmetrical, but it would look bold. It would necessitate shifting the I/O down a little. I think it would either look cool/interesting, or awkward/silly, it's a fine line I am too lazy to sketch it, but hopefully you can imagine what I mean. Either way, I think it's important that the case have some kind of a unique design element to give it character and distinguish it from all the other boxes. One thing I really like about your original design is the exhaust vent with the long parallel beams, sexy AF.
I guess the recessed i/o module is to make it removable, allowing you to offer alternatives (such as one having usb type C connectors in the future)? Because I think it, also, looks a bit off and strange (but acceptable if it's for a good reason).
For the I/O, could you just cut holes for each port into the front panel vs a rectangle cutout? You would have to ditch the M1 style I/O panel design, but if you mounted them to a bracket on the inside (vs mounting on the front panel), the front panel could still be removable. It would look a lot sleeker (in my opinion) without the break on the front panel. You could also orient the USB/Audio ports whichever way you wanted for the aestethic. Maybe put USB ports on one side, and audio ports on the other...or everything in a line on one side.
Is a short 1080/1080 Ti any less impressive than a full-size one? I mean, maybe, but in some respects it's more impressive to see a card like that in such a small case.With support for shorter cards, is there really a driver to show them off with the window? I'm not a huge fan of windows in general, so I may be biased.
But consider the following worst-case scenario:
Do you see the problem here?
- A customer buys the case and mounts it to his VESA stand. He grabs his standard 10mm screws to use for mounting (because why wouldn't he? He has no reason to believe he shouldn't).
- He doesn't realize one of the screws are touching his motherboard.
- He powers on the system, shorting his motherboard and destroying his computer.
- He investigates, finds a scorch mark where the screw is touching his motherboard, curses it for being such a terrible design.
I think you just need to change the way you're thinking about it. You know how you were always asking me if there was something we could do to change the design of the M1 so it could stand up vertically with the rear I/O at the top, FT03 style? Well, look:
This design is practically the same size as the M1 standing up (shorter, once you factor in a cable cover for the M1), but it's a lot narrower. And yet it makes you "cringe" now because of how thick it is.
Change how you think about it; not so much as a slim, console-style case, but as something between that and a vertical, FT03-mini/Corsair One style case.
So if I made it as wide as the M1, you'd like it more?I did use the word *proportions*. The M1 proportions works, so I never had problems with it.
The current case *proportions* is ugly, I made a paper weight to visualize it, and it's awful, that's why I raised my concerns.
So if I made it as wide as the M1, you'd like it more?
Could that be a non concern with usb 3.1 type c http://blog.hdmi.org/computex-2017-showcases-hdmi-alt-mode-usb-type-c-first-cables-multiple-demos/
I guess the recessed i/o module is to make it removable, allowing you to offer alternatives (such as one having usb type C connectors in the future)? Because I think it, also, looks a bit off and strange (but acceptable if it's for a good reason).
Definitely the second one. Blending the black into the end is the way to go. The other ones look a bit tacky in my opinion.Mockups of some different front I/O options:
The advantages of a separate section as in #1 and #2 is that it can be upgraded more easily and the ports labels are more legible. I think the M1 style (#2) doesn't work that well here, in part because the front panel feels truncated and imbalanced. It's more of a problem in the horizontal orientation, though.
Is a short 1080/1080 Ti any less impressive than a full-size one? I mean, maybe, but in some respects it's more impressive to see a card like that in such a small case.
Mockups of some different front I/O options:
The advantages of a separate section as in #1 and #2 is that it can be upgraded more easily and the ports labels are more legible. I think the M1 style (#2) doesn't work that well here, in part because the front panel feels truncated and imbalanced. It's more of a problem in the horizontal orientation, though.
Is a short 1080/1080 Ti any less impressive than a full-size one? I mean, maybe, but in some respects it's more impressive to see a card like that in such a small case.
We fight all the time, it's nothing new. Some conflict is a healthy sign for product development.
Manufacturing, quality control, distributing is a lot of time - time that I can spend doing other things. So at the end of day, I need to be passionate about the product to find it in myself to go through the process.
While I have no doubt the design is "honest" to form in Necere's opinion, at 96mm wide, the proportions are "honestly" too ugly for me to spend the time to go through the process. I literally cringed when I made a paper weight to get sense of the size.
I am on wahaha360 side with the proportions. The thickness is too high. I think you should not be higher as 60-70mm. My favorite design is this:
This will be a Ncase that I would buy by myself.
Mockups of some different front I/O options:
Necere would it be possible to get a side by side of the w360 original prototype and the rev.3
Necere Make sure you use my new model with updated window in the comparison pic.
That would be nice, but I don't know if it's feasible. Specifically, regular PC mic jacks have a 5V "polarizing voltage" or "bias voltage" (so says wikipedia, anyway) which is separate from the audio signal. With a TRRS jack, there aren't enough conductors for everything.headphone/mic jacks: I would love a single combined jack. I have had more headsets that required a splitter than not. It would be nice to ditch the dongle!
Well, air is kind of like water, in that it flows everywhere it can. Imagine putting a hose to the side of the cases and turning on the water. Will the case fill up and spill out the top? Of course. Same thing with air.Airflow: I'm worried about ventilation to the graphics card. will the air from the 140mm intake really make it around to the other side for the graphics card intake fans?
Window: I love the window, but it feels just a little small. It's almost like tunnel vision how the window kind of cuts off the edges of the graphics card. But what if you go out and get a really short card like the gigabyte gtx1070 mini? Will it still look cool? I'm afraid that my OCD tendency might bug me to no end if I didn't just get the zotac.
Here's an ASUS mini GPU (173mm):Have you considered how the window would look if an ITX-sized card like the Gigabyte 1070 Mini is used? Would there be too much of a gap there? I hear Gigabyte is working on a 1080 version that will have the same dimensions, so that may end up being the most popular dimension of card used. The extra window space may give people some creative liberty though, to try to display something else there. We do have to hope that the 1080 Ti is a success so they keep making short 250W cards that fit in this case.
The GPU takes up close to 70mm of the width (remember, there's a gap between it and the windowed side of the case) so there's only maybe an inch of free space on the back side. Stacked SSDs might be possible, but four at most. It's really the power cables that become a problem with stacking drives.Speaking of the GPU section, there will be so much leftover width in that section, even with the SSDs, you can probably fit another intake fan, but I guess it wouldn't be much use to blow on the backside of the GPU and so close to the exhaust. You could potentially stack SSDs like in the M1, and support up to 4 total? Or even 6? And still support triple slot short cards (SFF humor...)
That would disrupt the "wrapped shell" design of the case. Also the front ports can't go where you have them due to the PSU:What about if you incorporate the two tone front panel on the older design with the new design (sorry for my crappy MS Pain edits).
The GPU takes up close to 70mm of the width (remember, there's a gap between it and the windowed side of the case) so there's only maybe an inch of free space on the back side. Stacked SSDs might be possible, but four at most. It's really the power cables that become a problem with stacking drives.
That would disrupt the "wrapped shell" design of the case.
Also the front ports can't go where you have them due to the PSU
So let me try to explain a bit better why I don't want to do this.Could you make the front panel as you designed it, but two colors? I'm asking this with absolutely no knowledge on how you would do this, if it is possible, or practical...just throwing out ideas The top 3/4 of the front panel would be main color (red/silver/etc)...Bottom 1/4 of the front panel would be grey/black/etc. Top panel would flow with the main color and the bottom panel (with window) would flow with the secondary color?
No. You can see there's barely space for the ports as is.Oh yeah, forgot about the PSU! Would there be enough room if you stack the USB as you have it, but put the audio jacks beside vs on top?
Yes, see the previous post.On a separate topic, have you thought about using a single combo headphone/microphone jack vs two separate ports?
wahaha360 your model didn't have a stand, so I made one for it. Also the hole spacing on the intake vents reduces the open area to 19.6% (from 39.3% for the 45° staggered); that's a massive increase in restriction and in no way advisable.
I still maintain that the PCX layout doesn't lend itself to a window. I included the slim ODD so you can see how much it and the SATA connector protrude into the window.
I'd buy both, but I'd ditch the window on both. Specially on wahaha360's design. It honestly looks like an abortion, showing the underneath of the motherboard for no reason at all.
IMO, a window that only shows the gpu is pointless... but even more so when it shows things that you dont want to see. Small cases don't go along well with windows, specially cases that are aesthetically pleasing such as both.
Also the hole spacing on the intake vents reduces the open area to 19.6% (from 39.3% for the 45° staggered); that's a massive increase in restriction and in no way advisable.
I still maintain that the PCX layout doesn't lend itself to a window. I included the slim ODD so you can see how much it and the SATA connector protrude into the window.
on wahaha360's design. It honestly looks like an abortion, showing the underneath of the motherboard for no reason at all...IMO, a window that only shows the gpu is pointless... but even more so when it shows things that you dont want to see
I'd never heard of a panel window being compared to an abortion, but I see what you mean I appreciate what W360 is trying to do, but his design looks like a mutated organism that will not survive in the wild.
"abortion"...ROFLPersonally, I don't like the windows on either case, so as long as they are available without the window then I'll be happy.
See how with the break on the bend there's no radius so the line doesn't flow as smoothly:
There's also likely to be more of a panel gap due to the angle between the panels.
Another reason for having some flange on the side panel is it adds some much needed rigidity - particularly to the side with the window, which has little material between it and the edge otherwise.
That said, there is merit to putting the break on the bend like in your mockup, as it does present a cleaner surface.
I think the M1 style (#2) doesn't work that well here, in part because the front panel feels truncated and imbalanced. It's more of a problem in the horizontal orientation, though.
Adding a contrasting half as you suggest is inconsistent with this visual concept.
This version is a draft, so don't get into the weeds about # of holes, that stuff comes *after finalizing the main chassis/component brackets and style.
I don't want and never wanted to support ODD in general. The % of people using ODD is low, I know some may want this feature, but I wonder how many ppl end up installing one.
The window kit is optional, so the whole ODD cable connector through the window is blown out of proportion - it only affects the super minority who 1) installs ODD and 2) upgrade to the window kit.
"abortion"...ROFL
The window over the motherboard is to show M.2 drives, specifically the new ASROCK X299 ITX motherboard, where you can fit 2.
I understand it's not for everyone, hence why the widow is optional, I have *never had a case with a window and I don't intend to force it on people.
Another reason for the window, I get so many emails about window for the M1 (even though it's going to increase case temp, unless you perforate the window), making a window = get less email about it.
The reason for the window I understand, trust me. But it just looks ugly. Yes, yes. I know. Market trends and all that...
For me the ODD is like the Window, more trouble than it is worth, ideally, we should get rid of both.
If only you were part of Ncase, you could have both removed...