Horizon Forbidden West

robbiekhan said:
Nixxes mostly, Guerrilla messed up Zero Dawn remember and Nixxes had to come to the rescue and fix that.
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It was actually in a pretty good state at release considering it was the first time a Sony exclusive had been ported to PC. There were no game breaking bugs and they churned out patches in quick order to address the most glaring issues.
 
HZD was more or less fine after a few weeks, maybe 6 weeks, which is when I played it. Ran perfectly without any noticeable bugs. Glad that this port seems to be one of Sony's better ones at release. I assume whatever issues are there will be fixed shortly.
 
Yeah Naughty Dog had to take over and fix what Iron Galaxy messed up I remember now. That knocked them back a bit for sure

HZFW is my GoTY so far for PC releases. I've played 7.5 hours straight now. It quite possibly also is the most optimised AAA PC release this side of the last 5-10 years.
 
polonyc2 said:
the Zero Dawn PC port had multiple issues at launch...took around 6 months to fully fix...


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxiuU7ZNsZg
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If this is the video that I think it is, I remember watching it and thinking it was way too nitpicky, because by this time most of the problems that plagued the game day one had been resolved. Alex from DF is good. Don’t get me wrong, he really knows his stuff. But sometimes he can be… a little over the top.

Also, I can’t believe this but I still haven’t launched Forbidden West. Hard day at work. I’m in a foul mood and I don’t want to start the game like this. LOL.
 
robbiekhan said:
Yeah Naughty Dog had to take over and fix what Iron Galaxy messed up I remember now. That knocked them back a bit for sure

HZFW is my GoTY so far for PC releases. I've played 7.5 hours straight now. It quite possibly also is the most optimised AAA PC release this side of the last 5-10 years.
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Other way around. The PC port of Last of Us was primarily done in-house by Naughty Dog with some consulting from Iron Galaxy. IG then stepped in to help try and fix issues with it.
 
I started playing a bit. Weirdly, the performance was really good up until a certain part in the intro, when the framerate just tanked all of a sudden. I also had an issue where switching to DLSS from another method while in-game caused the framerate to drop to like 10 FPS. Not sure what was going on there.

Game looks gorgeous on the KTC OLED I bought recently.
 
I've got a dozen hours in on the PS5 version but will likely restart on the PC version for the FOV controls. The PS5 version was fine, but that zoomed in FOV (compared to my playthrough of HZD on PC) was tough to get used to.
 
Played for about three hours and am thoroughly enjoying HFW. Performance is great at 1440p with DLSS.

Story wise I'm really digging it. Opening introduction scene grabbed me good.
 
west2.jpg
 
MavericK said:
I also had an issue where switching to DLSS from another method while in-game caused the framerate to drop to like 10 FPS. Not sure what was going on there.

Game looks gorgeous on the KTC OLED I bought recently.
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yeah same. I was initially on Quality and wanted to see what i'd get with Ultra Performance. Both were -10fps, even when i switched back.
 
Regarding DLSS etc^^

Here were my findings, DLAA vs DLSS (3440x1440 & 5160x2160):

https://imgsli.com/MjQ5MzEz(do not compare the 3440 res ones with 5160 res as I have not rescaled the 5160 so when you zoom in with both side by side, the 3440 will look more pixellated as it's actually zooming in more to match the crop of the 5160 resolution so would be an optically unfair comparison to make)

I did some fps checks too and they were quite interesting, just in one scene looking at the vegetation:

3440x1440 DLAA, No FG: 98 fps average
3440x1440 DLSS Quality, No FG: 108 fps average
3440x1440 DLSS Ultra Performance, No FG: 111 fps average

The above leads me to believe that Nixxes are using proper DLSS Preset settings to get the best out of DLSS even in Ultra Performance at the cost of not much fps difference between Quality and Ultra Performance like you see in other games.

At DLSS Ultra Performance the temporal stability of the long grass about 20 feet in front of Aloy is visible but only if you look for it, from sitting back casually playing you'd never notice it really.

At DLAA and DLSS Quality the same temporal stability is 1:1 identical, no stability loss at all not even eyeballs up to the screen.

I also tried FSR 2.2 Quality and to my surprise I could not spot any temporal stability issues in the same grass, didn't try FSR Performance though but this so far is the first game I have played where FSR Quality has zero temporal instability - How have they managed to do what AMD themselves have never been able to do in AMD sponsored games...

The game's native SMAA method instead of DLAA is trash, it is temporally unstable in the same scene. The TAA method is much cleaner but eyeballs up close you can see it's not 100% as stable as DLAA/DLSS or FSR Quality.

DLSS Frame Gen has zero issues in this too,it just works and boosts fps. I'm not using it though as no real need. Don't need to exceed my refresh rate so no need to keep it bouncing at 141fps by using Frame Gen.

Me personally I'm using 3440x1440 DLSS Quality because the image has sharper details than with DLAA which is a neutral flat on the details in both 3440x1440 and 5160x2160. There is no advantage in this game for DLDSR it seems because everything else is rendered so good at all other resolutions/upscaler settings.
 
robbiekhan said:
Regarding DLSS etc^^

Here were my findings, DLAA vs DLSS (3440x1440 & 5160x2160):

https://imgsli.com/MjQ5MzEz(do not compare the 3440 res ones with 5160 res as I have not rescaled the 5160 so when you zoom in with both side by side, the 3440 will look more pixellated as it's actually zooming in more to match the crop of the 5160 resolution so would be an optically unfair comparison to make)

I did some fps checks too and they were quite interesting, just in one scene looking at the vegetation:

3440x1440 DLAA, No FG: 98 fps average
3440x1440 DLSS Quality, No FG: 108 fps average
3440x1440 DLSS Ultra Performance, No FG: 111 fps average

The above leads me to believe that Nixxes are using proper DLSS Preset settings to get the best out of DLSS even in Ultra Performance at the cost of not much fps difference between Quality and Ultra Performance like you see in other games.

At DLSS Ultra Performance the temporal stability of the long grass about 20 feet in front of Aloy is visible but only if you look for it, from sitting back casually playing you'd never notice it really.

At DLAA and DLSS Quality the same temporal stability is 1:1 identical, no stability loss at all not even eyeballs up to the screen.

I also tried FSR 2.2 Quality and to my surprise I could not spot any temporal stability issues in the same grass, didn't try FSR Performance though but this so far is the first game I have played where FSR Quality has zero temporal instability - How have they managed to do what AMD themselves have never been able to do in AMD sponsored games...

The game's native SMAA method instead of DLAA is trash, it is temporally unstable in the same scene. The TAA method is much cleaner but eyeballs up close you can see it's not 100% as stable as DLAA/DLSS or FSR Quality.

DLSS Frame Gen has zero issues in this too,it just works and boosts fps. I'm not using it though as no real need. Don't need to exceed my refresh rate so no need to keep it bouncing at 141fps by using Frame Gen.

Me personally I'm using 3440x1440 DLSS Quality because the image has sharper details than with DLAA which is a neutral flat on the details in both 3440x1440 and 5160x2160. There is no advantage in this game for DLDSR it seems because everything else is rendered so good at all other resolutions/upscaler settings.
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Super informative.
 
robbiekhan said:
Me personally I'm using 3440x1440 DLSS Quality because the image has sharper details than with DLAA which is a neutral flat on the details in both 3440x1440 and 5160x2160. There is no advantage in this game for DLDSR it seems because everything else is rendered so good at all other resolutions/upscaler settings.
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Yeah, that was my finding as well - DLSS Quality looked sharper than DLAA, but performance-wise there wasn't a huge difference between the two.
 
I played last night, fair warning, the PS 5 controller flat out broke my game for whatever reason. I was absolutely losing my mind, thinking I was going to have to sell my video card because my drivers weren't working. I was getting a constant 15 fps no matter what my settings were on my 7900 XTX. I ran AMD driver cleanup utility, DDU, reinstalled the game mutiple times etc. As soon as I stopped trying to use my PS 5 controller (shut it off) my FPS went up. I am not kidding, I was stuck at 15 FPS with it turned on. It didn't matter if I was 720p all low settings or 4k maxed. I'm running an Guili kit controller now and it's flawless. XeSS Quality maxed settings, hovering around 70-100 FPS.

I was so upset that AMD fucked up because that seems to be the common thread, it's the damn PS5 controller and I have no idea why. Just glad it's working, I loved Zero Dawn and I'm really looking forward to playing after work.
 
Decko87 said:
I played last night, fair warning, the PS 5 controller flat out broke my game for whatever reason. I was absolutely losing my mind, thinking I was going to have to sell my video card because my drivers weren't working. I was getting a constant 15 fps no matter what my settings were on my 7900 XTX. I ran AMD driver cleanup utility, DDU, reinstalled the game mutiple times etc. As soon as I stopped trying to use my PS 5 controller (shut it off) my FPS went up. I am not kidding, I was stuck at 15 FPS with it turned on. It didn't matter if I was 720p all low settings or 4k maxed. I'm running an Guili kit controller now and it's flawless. XeSS Quality maxed settings, hovering around 70-100 FPS.

I was so upset that AMD fucked up because that seems to be the common thread, it's the damn PS5 controller and I have no idea why. Just glad it's working, I loved Zero Dawn and I'm really looking forward to playing after work.
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You're not running a third-party driver for your Dualsense controller, are you?
 
Armenius said:
You're not running a third-party driver for your Dualsense controller, are you?
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Ohh that's a good point, I may have installed DS4Windows for one reason or another... I could see that potentially interfering. I completely forgot. I'll have to get rid of all of the relevant drivers from that and see if anything changes.
 
Decko87 said:
Ohh that's a good point, I may have installed DS4Windows for one reason or another... I could see that potentially interfering. I completely forgot. I'll have to get rid of all of the relevant drivers from that and see if anything changes.
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I'd try uninstalling that and using Steam Input instead. I am pretty sure both this game and the first game are made to work with it.
 
I somehow solved my stutter / hitching issue. I'm not really sure what I did, but I did go into NVCP and the new Nvidia app and reset the main GPU settings to defaults. I also forced RBAR support via Nvidia Profile Inspector. After a reboot, I noticed that the game takes longer to compile shaders. Initially the game would load fairly quick, I was surprised how fast it would load at the 'compiling shaders' status. I'm guessing it wasn't really compiling much, because now it is taking minutes to compile shaders and the stutter is gone.
 
robbiekhan said:
Me personally I'm using 3440x1440 DLSS Quality because the image has sharper details than with DLAA which is a neutral flat on the details in both 3440x1440 and 5160x2160.
Click to expand...
MavericK said:
Yeah, that was my finding as well - DLSS Quality looked sharper than DLAA, but performance-wise there wasn't a huge difference between the two.
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Daaaaaaaaaaaaang, DLSS Quality looks better than DLAA in this game?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!!!
 
Decko87 said:
Ohh that's a good point, I may have installed DS4Windows for one reason or another... I could see that potentially interfering. I completely forgot. I'll have to get rid of all of the relevant drivers from that and see if anything changes.
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Armenius said:
I'd try uninstalling that and using Steam Input instead. I am pretty sure both this game and the first game are made to work with it.
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I'm not sure if this port has native Dual Sense support or not. But, for games with native support, its best to disable steam input. A recent example is Tekken 8.
 
chameleoneel said:
I'm not sure if this port has native Dual Sense support or not. But, for games with native support, its best to disable steam input. A recent example is Tekken 8.
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I was actually just in the process of updating the firmware for my controller, I'm going to give it another shot and see if there's native DS 5 support. I know typically you have to have it wired for those features however.
 
Decko87 said:
I was actually just in the process of updating the firmware for my controller, I'm going to give it another shot and see if there's native DS 5 support. I know typically you have to have it wired for those features however.
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It has native support in windows 10. With the controller off press and hold the share and PS button together til it starts blinking then you will beable to pair it in the Bluetooth menu. Otherwise just plug it in and will work.
 
chameleoneel said:
I'm not sure if this port has native Dual Sense support or not. But, for games with native support, its best to disable steam input. A recent example is Tekken 8.
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I believe it was advertised as supporting the Dual Sense controller.
 
vegeta535 said:
It has native support in windows 10. With the controller off press and hold the share and PS button together til it starts blinking then you will beable to pair it in the Bluetooth menu. Otherwise just plug it in and will work.
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That wasn't the issue.
MavericK said:
I believe it was advertised as supporting the Dual Sense controller.
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It does
Armenius said:
You're not running a third-party driver for your Dualsense controller, are you?
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Completely uninstalling DS4 windows using a guide and dumping the app data and other installs it implements may have worked. I also got Sony's app to update the firmware of the controller. Everything is fixed now and there' no FPS degradation, DS5 native support is working. The bow feels crazy when you pull it back and shoot on the triggers, highly recommended. I will say it functions a bit better plugged in with USB C than over bluetooth.
 
Decko87 said:
That wasn't the issue.

It does

Completely uninstalling DS4 windows using a guide and dumping the app data and other installs it implements may have worked. I also got Sony's app to update the firmware of the controller. Everything is fixed now and there' no FPS degradation, DS5 native support is working. The bow feels crazy when you pull it back and shoot on the triggers, highly recommended. I will say it functions a bit better plugged in with USB C than over bluetooth.
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Maybe the hotfix will help?

Hey everyone,


Thank you for playing Horizon Forbidden West Complete Edition! We're thrilled to see you all continuing Aloy's adventure on PC and we really appreciate the outpouring of positive response and the constructive feedback you've given us so far.


Today's hotfix resolves some issues that could pop up while using a controller, in specific circumstances. The teams at Nixxes and Guerrilla continue to monitor player feedback and crash reports and are working on future updates.


Release Notes​


  • Fix for performance regression when using a DualSense controller wirelessly
  • Fix for missing prompts when connecting a controller after starting the game, while using Steam Input
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DrezKill said:
https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2024-the-big-horizon-forbidden-west-pc-tech-interview
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They're brilliant engineers, the game works flawlessly. CPU load seems well split across all cores, and I'm assuming that's because they're multithreading all of the decompression and sending textures to the GPU in an async manner. Most games typically run game logic on a main thread still, but a lot of the API calls are offloaded to other cores. I think their AI is simple the game logic is probably mostly single threaded, and probably most of the API calls are multithreaded. I could totally be wrong though, even unity ECS job system does game logic in a multithreaded approach, but you have to be extremely careful with it.
 
Decko87 said:
They're brilliant engineers, the game works flawlessly. CPU load seems well split across all cores, and I'm assuming that's because they're multithreading all of the decompression and sending textures to the GPU in an async manner. Most games typically run game logic on a main thread still, but a lot of the API calls are offloaded to other cores. I think their AI is simple the game logic is probably mostly single threaded, and probably most of the API calls are multithreaded. I could totally be wrong though, even unity ECS job system does game logic in a multithreaded approach, but you have to be extremely careful with it.
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The decompression part is interesting. GPU decompression has been kinda a fizzle on PC, so it's a little amusing they just punt the problem at the extra CPU and it's still faster than PS5's solution with no ill effects.

No weird spiky frametimes, hitches, or stutters, like what seems to plague an unfortunately massive chunk of titles today. Seems like a great port.
 
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