Zotac Mini PC @ Computer

Kinda like it. Agree that it would make a nice little TV PC, but I really don't get why they felt the need to give it 4x HDMI. Wouldn't think that very many people are interested in running surround off of laptop components.
 
AFD said:
Kinda like it. Agree that it would make a nice little TV PC, but I really don't get why they felt the need to give it 4x HDMI. Wouldn't think that very many people are interested in running surround off of laptop components.
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The only thing I can think of is for digital signage.
 
I'd use a computer like that to display dashboards in the office if the price is reasonable. Sure beats using a slew of unreliable and slow Raspberry Pi's!
 
That's already been announced as a steam machine, iirc. I think it's priced at $999 (it's on the steam store)
 
Not quite. The Steam Machine version is the SN970 (this is EN970). It has a couple of slight differences. The Steam version that was announced is slated to use Silverlake CPUs, and have a single HDMI input along side the three HDMI outputs. The initial reports were that both the Skylake CPU and the gtx 970m GPU were swappable, but that could just be miscommunication. Also, I had heard they were to be equipped with quad core variants, vs the dual core, quad thread Broadwell i5 5200u in this version, but again this could all be bunk. These new ones look like a followup to the older EN860 and EN760 Zboxes (those had gtx 860m but still dual core mobile i5 chips). I'm curious to see what kind of performance bottleneck the dual core CPU imposes on that 970m, but otherwise, these should be potent little gamer boxes.
 
Computex is a fucking SFF-fest, this is great! I liked the concept of the SN970 already, it'll be interesting to see how this one sells. The only problem I see with such small boxes is the upgrade-ability, but whatcha gonna do 'bout that? Other than that, really solid set of outputs. I wonder if they could produce this in lower performance and price realms to get closer to the console market.
 
Agreed. Also, I'd frankly lose my grip if either of these boxes truly is upgradable. The option to swap out that 970m for a Pascal or later equivalent could radically extend their lifespans.
 
Forgive the thread necromancy, but I've gotten to see the cpu/gpu side of the motherboard in this thing, and it is as I had initially though (thankfully)... so a bit of history before I explain what I've seen... The Zotac being addressed here is the Zotac Zbox Magnus EN970 (what a mouth full.) It is the sister model of the Zotac steam machine that was shown off at the beginning of the year, the Zotac SN970. Those were announced to have Skylake i5 and i7 cpus and a GTX970m - which i5 or i7 isn't known, but at least a few sites reported that these were quad core units, and that the GTX970m inside was on a removable MXM module. A few months later we were introduced to the model for which this thread was created. Initially, it was reported to have a dual core, quad thread i5 cpu (Broadwell i5 5200u to be precise), and a GTX970m. That information was changed in early August, late June, IIRC, to read that the unit contained a desktop GTX960, for one reason or another. Which brings me back here... after seeing the motherboard this morning, I can confirm that the CPU is an i5 5200u (not removable) and the gpu *IS* on a removable MXM module and appears to be a GTX970m - this thing is potentially upgradable. If the SN970 retains this design decision we could be looking at potentially the best 'micro PC' option yet - competent quad core cpus and upgradable MXM gpu? I'll take two!
 
Review of the system is up on Anandtech
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9660/zotac-zbox-magnus-en970-review-a-gaming-minipc-done-right
It has an MXM module as stated in the conclusion

So you get a weaksauce 15W tdp CPU but a GTX960/GTX970M GPU.

At least this is a very potent 1080p system for MOBA, CS:GO and older games, but with only 2 cores @ 2,7GHz I think it'll struggle with some heavier titles.

I don't like the gaming benchmarks they have done, yes they have done an apples to apples comparison to other mini-pc, but comparing it to a notebook of desktop would've been nice.
 
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I agree with that - I've seen material that indicates the gpu would be maxing out around 70% in most cases. The MXM bit is what intrigues me, honestly. This unit and the SN970 (due in November) are sister units, with the SN970 apparently having at least a single quad core Skylake option. If that turns out to have a quad core chip *and* an upgradable MXM, it could be worth a good look. I just noticed you commented on the article - based on what I've seen of the board layout and the cooler, I don't believe the mobile 980 will fit. The copper on the cooler is specifically cut for the 970m and there are two power connectors for the fans that are off to the side where the mobile 980 flares out.
 
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DarkStar01 said:
I agree with that - I've seen material that indicates the gpu would be maxing out around 70% in most cases. The MXM bit is what intrigues me, honestly. This unit and the SN970 (due in November) are sister units, with the SN970 apparently having at least a single quad core Skylake option. If that turns out to have a quad core chip *and* an upgradable MXM, it could be worth a good look. I just noticed you commented on the article - based on what I've seen of the board layout and the cooler, I don't believe the mobile 980 will fit. The copper on the cooler is specifically cut for the 970m and there are two power connectors for the fans that are off to the side where the mobile 980 flares out.
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If by sister units you mean exactly the same but the sn970 coming with steamOS, then I don't think there is a quadcore option, the 15W TDP 5200U already hits a scorching 102C under prime95+furmark load. Unless they have a beefier cooling solution for the SN970 that will be a major problem.
 
No, not at all what I mean. I think this unit was a stop gap, a prototype of sorts for the SN. The initial reports (which were correct about the removable MXM) were that the SN970 would come with skylake i5 and i7 models (at least one quad model) - these are broadwell, so clearly difderent in some respects. That out of the way, clearly we can't have our cpus roasting at over 100c, even under prime95, but if you've seen the coolers it might make some sense why it's getting that hot.
 
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Since I don't know if you'll even see the PM I sent, I'll explain my reasons for optimism. I think what's leading to those super high temps on that 5200u (other than the fact they were pushing it to the floor with Prime95) is the fact that there is only a single pipe leading from it to its cooler, while there are two leading over from the gpu. It seems the cpu cooler is monopolized by the gpu in that sense. If the gpu were provided a larger cooler of its own and the cpu cooler dedicated to the cpu alone, I don't think we'd see such issues, after all, we have seen i7 t-series chips in the Alphas, and they do perfectly fine with those measly little coolers.
 
I've just seen your PM, thanks, that clears up a lot.

Looking back at the Anandtech tests, with just the CPU loaded, temperatures stay much more reasonable, at around 82C.

I've done this type of testing on my system as well, and running Furmark AND Prime95 is the most unrealistic load you can put on a system. So during regular use this system could run well even with a quadcore, but it would have to throttle under the Furmark+Prime95 test.

They are doing what most gaming notebooks are do, sharing the heat across all heatsinks, with the GPU having 2 heatsinks at its disposal.
 
That was my thought as well, figuring at worst it might require a slightly different cooler layout. I'm happy my PM was of use - those images were hard to dig up, but I found the layout quite interesting and thought you might as well.
 
This would be a compelling system if Zotac put an i5-6440HQ cpu (45W) and had one display port.
 
Techreport has an article up on the SN970 now, confirming my original statements - The units will be available with at least Skylake i5 6400T series CPUs, so quad core, quad thread @ 35 watts.

Edit: Upon inspection of the exterior of the unit, some personal conjecture pertaining to the cooling configuration appears to be correct as well. As QinX and I had both noticed from a somewhat exhaustive review of the sister unit (En970), cooling could become an issue - the En970 was reading at 102° with a Broadwell i5 5200u (dual core). Those temperatures were registered under abnormal load (Prime95 + Furmark). Inspection of the motherboard and cooling solution, in concert with the circumstances which produced the temperatures to begin with, lead me to believe a slight modification of the cooling assembly (while unnecessary under *ordinary* work loads) would easily accommodate a quad core CPU. That would be important if some of the earliest information pertaining to the SN970 were true (that they were equipped with quad core CPUs and discrete gtx970m graphics). Now that those details are a more known factor, I felt it time to investigate a bit, and in doing so, I've noticed the exterior of the unit has undergone slight change, incorporating what appears to be a slightly taller chassis with many more ventilation slits.

Edit 2: Further inspection shows loss of standard USB ports at the front of the unit, replaced with a single USB type C port. There is also a rumor circulating that the unit has lost one 2.5" drive bay compared to the EN970 model.
 
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Since I'd rather not continue to edit the same post from here to eternity, I'll simply place my findings in a new one. Now that these units are out in the wild for review, I've had a good look at several aspects that may be of interest. The CPU in the NEN SN970 is in fact socketed, as opposed to soldered to the board. This should allow some freedom when it comes time to upgrade, but comes at the expense of a single 2.5" HDD connector (its sister unit, the EN970 has the option for two). Furthermore, the GPU board provided (a GTX 970m, which Zotac continually refers to as an 'OEM GTX 960') is connected via a standard MXM 3.0b connector, meaning that too is potentially upgradable. From an aftermarket modding perspective, this thing could be a Pandora's box.
 
The problem with MXM is still that you've got to put the gpu bios on the motherboard isn't it? Which means you'll need to get a card that has a bios upgrade for some laptop, be able to rip it from there and hope it fits in this board's eprom.

As for the cpu upgrade - i'd go for top notch cpu instead of loosing option of two 2.5" drives and if warranty stand for 3 years then after those you'll get a new, more powerful one instead of upgrading since the socket would be already not supported.
 
The real problem for the most mxm systems is, that the motherboard bios must know the gpu. Otherwise you could not install drivers or you will have a blck screen. Mxm was not designed to upgrade systems it was designed for easily manufracturing a notebook serie with different gpus. So the manufracture don't have to produce different motherboards.

The next thing is that it could be that future mxm cards whould not work because there are missing parts on the boards that it neccessary for the mxm gpu.
 
True enough - my statement is mostly one of curiosity. Oh and Saper, you don't have to sacrifice 2.5s altogether - there were spaces for two of them in the sister model to this one, but only one on this model, since the cpu bracket at the back of the motherboard interferes.
 
Yeah, I got this earlier. It's just that I'll usually like to have SSD for apps and HDD for data so it's a must have for me to have two 2.5" drives
 
Oh, I catch your drift now. That's understandable. As it stands with this particular unit, there's still the m.2 option, but that's not always ideal. BTW, on my previous subject of the MXM module, Zotac apparently mentioned something about going this route in the event they decide to offer different GPU options in the future. I suppose that's the meat of what I've been getting at - physical upgrade vector is there. It's that software side (bios, dricers, etc.) that remains to be seen, and while it may never materialize, it's still a curious design decision in my mind (I've only ever seen two mini PCs with discrete MXMs).

Also, any itinerary for your cases, Saper and Dondan? I'm pretty pumped for both, no lie.
 
this MXM use roadmap is always a tryout if people catch on this - they'll re-release it on newer generations gpu with newer cpu sockets. It never catches on since its not mainstream.

This would work only if Valve decided on this type of machine to be official steam machine setup and every vendor would need to comply with MXM support for upgrade and motherboard standard etc. For example we would have Zotac and Alienware boxes that would be exactly the same on the inside.

But it won't work. it's too late for that since microsoft already backed off from locking out steam off windows platform and valve stopped caring and went the other way.

As for our roadmap - we're pretty close to ordering or final prototypes, this time for sure since there's not much to figure out anymore. we just need some time this weekend for preparing manufacturing documentation for them. Hopefully we'll be live by the end of the year with everything.
 
That's probably why there are so few minis with those discrete boards - it's a catch 22 I think. Regardless, it's great to see some headway on your case. This coming year, I'm in dire need of smaller cases for systems around the house, so naturally I try to keep pace with both your case and Dondan's (which is borderline impossible while raising my girls.) Fingers crossed, I'm hopeful to acquire one of each.
 
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