Why do Mice manufacturer's have such shit software?

[Ikasu]

More of a rant. But why does every bloated pos from brand manufacturers suck so bad? Looking at all the major brands, they are all bloatware infested piles of garbage that don't even function properly to begin with. I look back at my older mice that used Logitech Gaming Software and miss it dearly...Unfrotunately no compatibility with current gen mice at all. Ghub is terrible, razer is garbage (currently using), and I heard equal of the others as I try to hunt down a new mouse.

My old LGS based mice worked great over the years (G9, G9X, G502, G502 Hero, etc), lasted for years, and LGS app detection and profile switching worked instantaneously. Switched to a Razer Basilisk Ultimate, as it had a similar body to my G502, and feels great...But man the quality of the internals must be terrible. Had phantom scrolling issues on the mouse wheel within a year, sent it in for a warranty replacement for a brand new one, few months later, same problem. Layer on top the fact that their app detection profile takes a second or two to switch, alt tabbing too fast breaks the detection, and sometimes even gets locked up for a few minutes before it finally starts switching as it should.

Looking up Rtings, the only mice that support app detection profile switching are some of the major brands. Corsair, SteelSeries, Razer, Asus, and Logitech...But reading reviews online about their software are nothing but horror stories. Has anyone come across any open source solutions? There has to be something out there. I shit you not, I'm one step away from disassembling the internals of my g903, and purchasing a g502x to frankenstein together a mouse that feels good, and actually works with Logitech Gaming Software....

 

[KazeoHin]

It all xi jingping/zukkerberg spyware to collect data.

If you could gain an extra $100,000 per year off of software for every user who purchases your software because either a chinese authoritarian or a western monopoly wants to pay for the data, would you say no?

If so, awesome! good job being a moral and ethical business owner, but then someone else will, and they'll make more money to produce/advertise competing products.

The system rewards certain things and uplift them over others.

 

[Starfalcon]

Why dont you just buy another G502 hero?

https://www.newegg.com/logitech-910-005469-g502-hero-usb-wired/p/3C6-0064-00002?Item=3C6-0064-00002

On sale for $40 and still works with LGS. I just bought this one to replace my 5 year old G502 hero that started double clicking.

 

[Ikasu]

Why dont you just buy another G502 hero?

https://www.newegg.com/logitech-910-005469-g502-hero-usb-wired/p/3C6-0064-00002?Item=3C6-0064-00002

On sale for $40 and still works with LGS. I just bought this one to replace my 5 year old G502 hero that started double clicking.

I have three of them in my closet brand new. Bought them when I was still using wired mice. Made the switch to wireless about a year and a half ago, otherwise I'd just bust one of those boxes open. Unfortunately the G502 lightspeed, X, and X Plus all are logitech G-hub based =*(.

 

[Darunion]

Because making the software really good might sell a couple mice but the ROI on it might not even occur.

 

[Ikasu]

Because making the software really good might sell a couple mice but the ROI on it might not even occur.

On the contrary though, having shit software will turn buyers away. That's basically what is happening when you read up on the logitech subreddit. Buyers abandoning logitech hardware due to their terrible software now. It's been 4 years of peeps complaining about ghub, and it's still shit as the day it was released. The part that is the most confusing about all of this, is Logitech Gaming Software is a superior piece of software, albeit older and not supported anymore. Everything pretty much just works in LGS....It may have an older interface and design aesthetic...But it has very few flaws. When used with app detection, it instantaneous in switching profiles, I've never seen it hiccup or freeze in this endeavor. It also has great macro support, and a loyal fanbase considering how many people complain about ghub, with many posts regarding Logitech Gaming Software.

Logitech literally downgraded themselves massively...for what? The sake of releasing "new" inferior software? Just boggles the mind.

 

[Darunion]

On the contrary though, having shit software will turn buyers away. That's basically what is happening when you read up on the logitech subreddit. Buyers abandoning logitech hardware due to their terrible software now. It's been 4 years of peeps complaining about ghub, and it's still shit as the day it was released. The part that is the most confusing about all of this, is Logitech Gaming Software is a superior piece of software, albeit older and not supported anymore. Everything pretty much just works in LGS....It may have an older interface and design aesthetic...But it has very few flaws. When used with app detection, it instantaneous in switching profiles, I've never seen it hiccup or freeze in this endeavor. It also has great macro support, and a loyal fanbase considering how many people complain about ghub, with many posts regarding Logitech Gaming Software.

Logitech literally downgraded themselves massively...for what? The sake of releasing "new" inferior software? Just boggles the mind.

I agree mostly. It is a hard sell to the executive team in a lot of cases for putting a lot of money into software when you sell hardware. Maybe the mouse sales dont actually mean much to them to warrant putting more effort into it. I myself have never used profile switching of any kind so i cant comment on that, i just use a sensitivity button on the mouse to move it up or down if im gaming or im doing photo work.

And not all companies make good decisions, often you have someone start steering the ship into an iceburg. I hope they improve. I used to use exclusively logitech stuff but prices actually have pushed me into razer more now. I still like corded mice like an old person should haha.

 

[Dan_D]

It's not just mouse manufacturers. Any company that has hardware with RGB LED lighting and software for that is all trash. Motherboard software is trash too. Generally speaking, hardware companies make hardware and software is a secondary concern. The only companies that even remotely care are NVIDIA and AMD as it has more to do with the overall computing experience and gaming compatibility. Everyone else? They just want it to gather data and look good for the two minutes you use it to set things up. After that, it doesn't really matter.

 

[toast0]

Generally speaking, hardware companies make hardware and software is a secondary concern.

This is pretty much it. Mostly I've only needed mouse software to adjust the disco settings and then you can leave it uninstalled. But I don't have mice with 37 buttons and macros.

 

[uOpt]

Let's face it: most drivers and other hardware control software that doesn't have to go through Microsoft's vetting process is lousy.

 

[LukeTbk]

Generally speaking, hardware companies make hardware and software is a secondary concern.

This could be the case, what percentage of user install them to start with ?

I think a lot of people are happy not too and do not

 

[Dan_D]

This could be the case, what percentage of user install them to start with ?

I think a lot of people are happy not too and do not

I'd wager most people don't install motherboard software or mouse software unless they need it for a specific reason. After that, they'll either uninstall it if they can or let it languish and not bother to update or really use it.

 

[Darunion]

This could be the case, what percentage of user install them to start with ?

I think a lot of people are happy not too and do not

If i plug in my mouse and a cursor moves around the screen, im usually good

 

[LukeTbk]

If i plug in my mouse and a cursor moves around the screen, im usually good

Specially that now side buttons, scroll, etc... tend to work in most app out of the box without any extra app needed.

I imagine there is high end gamers outthere with different speed-setting by games that use them ?

 

[blackmomba]

On the contrary though, having shit software will turn buyers away. That's basically what is happening when you read up on the logitech subreddit. Buyers abandoning logitech hardware due to their terrible software now. It's been 4 years of peeps complaining about ghub, and it's still shit as the day it was released. The part that is the most confusing about all of this, is Logitech Gaming Software is a superior piece of software, albeit older and not supported anymore. Everything pretty much just works in LGS....It may have an older interface and design aesthetic...But it has very few flaws. When used with app detection, it instantaneous in switching profiles, I've never seen it hiccup or freeze in this endeavor. It also has great macro support, and a loyal fanbase considering how many people complain about ghub, with many posts regarding Logitech Gaming Software.

Logitech literally downgraded themselves massively...for what? The sake of releasing "new" inferior software? Just boggles the mind.

Where those buyers gonna go... SteelSeries software is just as shitty... ICue even shittier...

 

[Ikasu]

I agree mostly. It is a hard sell to the executive team in a lot of cases for putting a lot of money into software when you sell hardware. Maybe the mouse sales dont actually mean much to them to warrant putting more effort into it. I myself have never used profile switching of any kind so i cant comment on that, i just use a sensitivity button on the mouse to move it up or down if im gaming or im doing photo work.

And not all companies make good decisions, often you have someone start steering the ship into an iceburg. I hope they improve. I used to use exclusively logitech stuff but prices actually have pushed me into razer more now. I still like corded mice like an old person should haha.

I feel you...I don't really game as much anymore, and use my mouse and keyboard for more productivity work in 3D. With all the apps I use, nice to have specific profiles on my mouse for additional functionality for often used workflows...Hence the app profile switching. Guess it's not a major concern for the masses though. It's just sad to see the reality of what Logitech has become. I've sworn by their products for decades, but they really shot themselves in the foot with this. Further enforced by the fact a decent majority use their Onboard Memory Profile application instead, only installing G-Hub once for the initial setup, then removing it.

If anyone thinks I'm overstating how bad g-hub is, a quick google search of "Ghub is terrible, reddit", brings a couple of pages full of results. Heading over to the LogitechG subreddit at this exact moment, the first post that popped up is "Logitech GHUB app is the worst application ever known to mankind" with 73 comments...lol. With most of these topics most likely being removed by moderators =(. Just astounds me how far they have fallen. I love logitech's hardware, especially when I spend $100+ on a mouse, I expect it to work, but I guess that's asking too much. On the contrary, where as my razer basilisk ultimate has had the same hardware issue on a brand new replacement, on top of having terrible software =(.

It's not just mouse manufacturers. Any company that has hardware with RGB LED lighting and software for that is all trash. Motherboard software is trash too. Generally speaking, hardware companies make hardware and software is a secondary concern.

Can't agree enough with that. I dread the thought to having to install Asus Aura to control the rgb in my system, or the malware known as Armoury Crate =P. Luckily G.Skill has it's own rgb software for it's memory, so able to install it instead to turn off my rams RGB.

It's just sad to see that this is the overall truth though, as bad software can ruin the experience of good hardware. In the graphics card market it is system breaking, sad to see it being a low priority for Mice and keyboards.

Where those buyers gonna go... SteelSeries software is just as shitty... ICue even shittier...

This made me actually laugh. Yea, sad truth.

 

[atarione]

Lenovo's driver / software isn't too bad for their mice... I just bought a M600 because it was one of very few (maybe the only?) truly ambidextrous wireless design (buttons both sides) I could find. I love the size and shape of the m600 but the scroll wheel is pretty terrible, squeaks ... but if you are a left handed palm grip mouse user the landscape is bleak ...even bleaker because the M600 was replaced with the M600S which is not ambidextrous.

I wish steel series would let you just install the engine and not their stupid GG suite.. but I do love the size and shape of the Sensei Ten as well... but the suite is bullsh*t. A modern wireless Sensei w/ engine only would absolutely kick ass...

 

[techie81]

More of a rant. But why does every bloated pos from brand manufacturers suck so bad? Looking at all the major brands, they are all bloatware infested piles of garbage that don't even function properly to begin with. I look back at my older mice that used Logitech Gaming Software and miss it dearly...Unfrotunately no compatibility with current gen mice at all. Ghub is terrible, razer is garbage (currently using), and I heard equal of the others as I try to hunt down a new mouse.

My old LGS based mice worked great over the years (G9, G9X, G502, G502 Hero, etc), lasted for years, and LGS app detection and profile switching worked instantaneously. Switched to a Razer Basilisk Ultimate, as it had a similar body to my G502, and feels great...But man the quality of the internals must be terrible. Had phantom scrolling issues on the mouse wheel within a year, sent it in for a warranty replacement for a brand new one, few months later, same problem. Layer on top the fact that their app detection profile takes a second or two to switch, alt tabbing too fast breaks the detection, and sometimes even gets locked up for a few minutes before it finally starts switching as it should.

Looking up Rtings, the only mice that support app detection profile switching are some of the major brands. Corsair, SteelSeries, Razer, Asus, and Logitech...But reading reviews online about their software are nothing but horror stories. Has anyone come across any open source solutions? There has to be something out there. I shit you not, I'm one step away from disassembling the internals of my g903, and purchasing a g502x to frankenstein together a mouse that feels good, and actually works with Logitech Gaming Software....

Agreed GHUB is terrible. I was getting random VAC errors in DOD:S and the only way to get the game to load was to disable GHUB. I only needed it to change some simple config with the mouse buttons but I hate it.

 

[Ikasu]

Agreed GHUB is terrible. I was getting random VAC errors in DOD:S and the only way to get the game to load was to disable GHUB. I only needed it to change some simple config with the mouse buttons but I hate it.

That is just upsetting. From what I've seen most people just use G-Hub once to setup a profile and enable the onboard memory, uninstall it, then use Logitech Onboard Memory Manager software instead. Wish this was a solution for me, but hopefully that might help you out a bit. Wish it supported app detection, would make my life a lot easier.

 

[Prince Valiant]

Where those buyers gonna go... SteelSeries software is just as shitty... ICue even shittier...

The sad truth of it. It's a shame, CUE had some minor issues but it was alright in my use and has a lot of macro options. Cooler Master's ControlPad could have been great but the software is mediocre and there were still unresolved issues the last time I checked (certain keys have limited mapping options).

 

[Westwood]

G-Hub single handedly killed all Logitech devices for me. I wouldn't buy a Logitech stapler if they offered one.

 

[Ikasu]

G-Hub single handedly killed all Logitech devices for me. I wouldn't buy a Logitech stapler if they offered one.

I feel you. I just ordered a logitech G502 X Plus from amazon since they have it on sale for $129.99. Gonna give it a shot and try it to see if I can live with g-hub. Got a phantom scrolling issue on my brand new warranty replacement razer basilisk ultimate...Along with the terrible app switching profiles that lag, thought why not....try the G502 wireless and see if I can live with G-Hub.

Honestly though, already putting my money on returning it.

 

[UnknownSouljer]

Logitech certainly isn't the best ever, but I find Options+ to at least do what it says and be relatively light weight. Could also be because it's designed for macOS from the ground up without any legacy code due to the ARM transition. I imagine a problem on PC side is that they can be lazy and in general just keep using the same trash over and over again and bandaid on a slightly new mouse model or whatever.

 

[Ikasu]

Logitech certainly isn't the best ever, but I find Options+ to at least do what it says and be relatively light weight. Could also be because it's designed for macOS from the ground up without any legacy code due to the ARM transition. I imagine a problem on PC side is that they can be lazy and in general just keep using the same trash over and over again and bandaid on a slightly new mouse model or whatever.

Haven't looked at Options+ at all, but knowing it doesn't support the LogitechG line is super unfortunate. If it did, and had app detection support and what not, I'd hop on it to test in a heartbeat.

Really sucks being a hybrid user, that is a gamer as well as 3D/Productivity work. Want the hardware advantages of Lightspeed wireless and latency that the G line provides, but G-Hub is such a bloated and unintuitive piece of garbage =*(.

 

[AVATARAT]

If you want a good mouse software, go for Bloody/A4Tech.

 

[Prince Valiant]

Logitech certainly isn't the best ever, but I find Options+ to at least do what it says and be relatively light weight. Could also be because it's designed for macOS from the ground up without any legacy code due to the ARM transition. I imagine a problem on PC side is that they can be lazy and in general just keep using the same trash over and over again and bandaid on a slightly new mouse model or whatever.

All would be well if Logitech kept re-skinning LGS. The problem is they ditched the decent software and replaced it with trash. It's the same story for other companies.

 

[AVATARAT]

My problem is driving me crazy, I don't know what to do anymore. I’m having weird mouse problems when playing games (mouse becomes fast and slow, is inaccurate and sometimes unresponsive), I think it may have to do with electricity as I’ve changed every part of my PC trying to fix the issue and there is no clear explanation why I’m having such problems. I never had such an issue and the last thing in my mind is electricity. I'm thinking about getting a double conversion UPS maybe that would fix my issue? I have good FPS, for example in CSGO I get 500+ fps but the mouse movement is nowhere smooth as it was. I've tried tweaking bios settings, windows settings, of course turned off G-SYNC and V-SYNC, turned off mouse accell and no results. Please, help :C

You probably have a problem with too high Report Rate, try to lower it to 500Hz or 250Hz, sometimes when it is 1000 (or more) it can produce stuttering.

 

[Armenius]

I have not had any issue with GHub from the technical side of things, I just always hated the interface design and how they dumbed it down. The newest version of GHub is starting to feel like LGS again, so maybe they're finally learning/listening.

 

[Ikasu]

I have not had any issue with GHub from the technical side of things, I just always hated the interface design and how they dumbed it down. The newest version of GHub is starting to feel like LGS again, so maybe they're finally learning/listening.

Doubt it...They've been ignoring requests for years in the reddit community. I would constantly check in from time to time since the release of g-hub as I've always had logitech mice for a couple of decades, which became even more vital as I really wanted a lightspeed wireless g502. The same problems and requests have been asked for years, with LGS support stating it's been elevated to their support/dev team....Only for NOTHING to change for YEARS. Perfect example of a company with good hardware, but completely incompetent software development team. I have avoided updating my software for a few months since I got my G502X Plus. I absolutely despise how on its own G-Hub adds game profiles for every game on your system, it scans without permissions and finds games and creates additional profiles I don't need, and cannot delete due to the absurdity that is G-Hubs design. I have to manually go to each app in my profile and disable automatic profile switching everytime a new title is added, as this piece of malware adds them automatically....To make matters worse, the profile added is based on the default from factory settings for the G-hub, not the main profile I have setup which has my preferred DPI and hotkeys. So even if I wanted to use said new profile, I have to reconfigure it for every new game from scratch if I want mouse hotkeys for it.

I did however find a file that contains a list of a game list and profiles provided by Logitech in the program files directory of the app, which is used by g-hub as a game directory to scan against and maintain key profiles to be added for said games....Deleting said file stops this behavior of G-hub adding profiles for every damn game. Did this immediately when I formatted my pc recently to avoid all the cluttered game profiles. Unfortunately I didn't disable auto update, not knowing the software had it enabled by default. It updated my g-hub, and low and behold....all these profiles have been added that clutter my interface, and cannot be removed. To make matters worse, g-hub instantly launches as soon as its installed...So getting rid of this file profile proves to be problematic. I'll have to try again while monitoring the folder during the installation process to see if I can remove it mid install....But the fact that I even have to do something like this is bewildering and shocking.

In terms of functionality, the app works and puts the once in a lifetime razer purchase I made to shame in terms of just working on the software side...But in terms of being user intuitive, designed with rational and logical direction, and not be obtrusive....It has completely failed.

Hardware wise though, love this G502X Plus. I just wish I could use LGS for it.

 

[criccio]

That is just upsetting. From what I've seen most people just use G-Hub once to setup a profile and enable the onboard memory, uninstall it, then use Logitech Onboard Memory Manager software instead.

Yep, except you don't need to set it up with GHUB.

I have a few Logitech mice and have complete control over them with OMM, never touch GHUB at all. I don't have a need for profiles, I have one setup, one DPI for everything.

 

[Ikasu]

Yep, except you don't need to set it up with GHUB.

I have a few Logitech mice and have complete control over them with OMM, never touch GHUB at all. I don't have a need for profiles, I have one setup, one DPI for everything.

Yea, I confirmed this once I got my mouse, so you are right there. But OMM doesn't support app detection profiles. Which I need for workflow reasons....Specific shortcuts setup for 3D apps, as well as some misc apps as well, which unfortunately rules out OMM for me =*(. Otherwise I would gladly use OMM.

 

[Ebernanut]

Bad Logitech software has been an ongoing issue for them and as soon as they get their software in decent shape they abandon it and force all new devices after that to use whatever buggy and broken garbage they replace it with. It happened with Setpoint, then LGS, and I imagine that it will happen again with Ghub once they fix it.

My first mouse was a Logitech that came with Windows 3.1 and I've mostly had their mice since then and every time I've tried something else I went back to them but I might finally be done with them. Their software sucks but based on reviews so does the software from every other brand, their switches seem more prone than most to fail quickly* too but the real issue for me is that they no longer have a palm grip model for large hands. The g602 was the last mouse they made that fits my hands decently, the g604 was just a tad skinnier but it was enough to make my pinky and ring fingers end up awkwardly smashed together on the side where they would cramp.

One of my last two g602 died recently and after looking at tons of models and reading reviews I ended up with an Asus Spatha x which is far from my favorite(g700s was my all time favorite) but it's decent enough and is a better fit than any of the current Logitech ones. The software isn't great but it's better than Ghub was the last time I used it, after getting it all configured properly the only issue I've had is the automatic profile switching not working a few times when I alt+tabbed out of a game.

*I bought a g604 when they came out and the switches failed in under a week and started double clicking.

 

[dogDAbone]

Well, I firmly believe in the K.I.S.S. method when it comes to software, and many other things too

I have been using Logitech's G613's & MX Masters for almost 10 years, and have yet to find any need whatsoever for their software.

Yea I played with Setpoint and the other stuff from that era, which was fairly stable and worked ok, but since it didn't really add much other than a few basic configuration options, I ditched it really quick just because I didn't see any need to clutter up my system with unneeded softwarez...

But OTOH, I don't do that R.f'n.G.f'n.B.f'n nonsense nor have any use for 28.735 buttons or multiple profiles either at work or at home, so there's that

 

[jameswilliam]

More of a rant. But why does every bloated pos from brand manufacturers suck so bad? Looking at all the major brands, they are all bloatware infested piles of garbage that don't even function properly to begin with. I look back at my older mice that used Logitech Gaming Software and miss it dearly...Unfrotunately no compatibility with current gen mice at all. Ghub is terrible, razer is garbage (currently using), and I heard equal of the others as I try to hunt down a new mouse.

My old LGS based mice worked great over the years (G9, G9X, G502, G502 Hero, etc), lasted for years, and LGS app detection and profile switching worked instantaneously. Switched to a Razer Basilisk Ultimate, as it had a similar body to my G502, and feels great...But man the quality of the internals must be terrible. Had phantom scrolling issues on the mouse wheel within a year, sent it in for a warranty replacement for a brand new one, few months later, same problem. Layer on top the fact that their app detection profile takes a second or two to switch, alt tabbing too fast breaks the detection, and sometimes even gets locked up for a few minutes before it finally starts switching as it should.

Looking up Rtings, the only mice that support app detection profile switching are some of the major brands. Corsair, SteelSeries, Razer, Asus, and Logitech...But reading reviews online about their software are nothing but horror stories check out Marketing Agency Dublin. Has anyone come across any open source solutions? There has to be something out there. I shit you not, I'm one step away from disassembling the internals of my g903, and purchasing a g502x to frankenstein together a mouse that feels good, and actually works with Logitech Gaming Software....

I loved my old Logitech MX518...they don't even make them anymore. They have some newer variant where the wire up top gets loose and the mouse movement becomes choppy and intermittent. I've gone through 2 in 2 years now... So I'm looking for some suggestions for a wireless mouse for office use. The problem is I'm feeling pretty wary of getting another Logitech.

 

[Ikasu]

I loved my old Logitech MX518...they don't even make them anymore. They have some newer variant where the wire up top gets loose and the mouse movement becomes choppy and intermittent. I've gone through 2 in 2 years now... So I'm looking for some suggestions for a wireless mouse for office use. The problem is I'm feeling pretty wary of getting another Logitech.

Had one myself, the old Mx518, as well as mx500. If you are looking for wireless and office productivity, and don't plan to install any games and be bombarded with individual profiles, I'd actually still recommend logitech. I love my G502X Plus. The app detection profiles work very well for my productivity workflow. Where as the Razer I had would freeze up constantly for minutes at a time (app detection that is). As well as having a phantom scrolling issue a year into owning the mouse, and my warranty replacement exhibiting the same problem in 3 months of use, which was also a brand new mouse.

Not sure about the other brands, as I tended to stick to logitech for decades. If you do go the logitech route though and don't need app profiles, don't install G-hub...Just install Logitech On-Board Memory Manager (OMM) and call it a day.