What PSU for a 64 gaming system?

C

Clownboat

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 25, 2004
Messages
322
I'm building a system with the following components:

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3200+ ClawHammer
mobo: MSI K8N Neo Platinum
GPU: BFG Technologies GeForce 6800GT OC
RAM: 2 x 512 Corsair ValueSelect CAS 2.5 PC3200
HDD: 2 Western Digital Raptor 36.7 GB in RAID 0
drive: some random DVD+/-RW / CD-RW
monitor: 17" LCD
several USB devices
fans, fans, fans!

I don't know much about PSUs, other than to (A) get the most amps possible over the +5V and +12V rails, (B) get a decent wattage if you're using stuff like what's listed above, and (C) get a good brand name and don't be cheap.

I have around $100 to spend on a PSU. That's nowhere near set in stone, but that's a ballpark maximum I'd wanna spend, give or take $25 or so. I want something 420W or above, if for nothing more than peace of mind, seeing as how I'm runing the CPU and GPU I am. Also, the PSU doesn't have to be future-proof ATX 2.2 stuff. I don't plan on upgrading to a PCI-Express capable system anytime soon, so I'd be willing to buy another PSU at that time.

Oh, and I plan on doing some light overclocking on the CPU and video card. Nothing too extreme, but just about as far as I can go on stock cooling.

So! What's your recommendation for the best power supply for me?
 
You need to review your thought process, You just listed over $1000.00 worth of good stuff
why try and get by on good enough?
I had an Enermax 465, was good but.......
PC Power & Cooling = Real stable,gives you the room to do what you want.
and if I were to sleep at night (and not frag) I'd sleep like a baby! knowing my rig is getting all those important electrons so necassary to help keep your rig strong and healthy :D
 
I have a 300W Fortron w/ 120mm fan. Very quiet, more stable rails then my antec 400W, in the same system.

i say get teh 350 or 400 if you really want it.
 
The thread you posted doesn't help me that much because I'm looking at things in a different price range.

Also, I don't understand the comment about my thought process and how much the stuff I've already decided on is worth. Are you trying to imply I'm being a cheapskate with the PSU? Whether that's true or not, the money I have to spend on it isn't going to change.

Back to my question...

I was wondering about the Antec True480/550 PSUs. They look good but the +12V rail seems a little weak.

As far as PC Power & Cooling or Enermax go, what specific units?
 
No no no , Wasn't at all implying that. It's just that alot of people build real sweet rigs and try to make do with the PS. I understand that after spending that kind of kaaasch, a ps that is good enough will do. I'm just from the school of "lets give the best components the best juice!" That way you won't worry about it.
This PCP&Cooling 510 is amazingly stable at all levels and actually allows for a greater (however small) Ovclk.

You even zero in on what I'm saying:
"I was wondering about the Antec True480/550 PSUs. They look good but the +12V rail seems a little weak."

Why even bother with "seems a little weak" worry?
 
For Enermax: Any of the Noisetaker or Coolergiant models, they are new and well designed with multiple +12v rails.
For Antec: A Tru480 would power that system just fine. Even tho the +12v rail seems a little weak, I've got a similar system for CPU draw, with 5 hard drives in it right now on a Tru480. It's a good, strong supply
 
Clownboat said:
The thread you posted doesn't help me that much because I'm looking at things in a different price range.
Click to expand...

the thread I posted had a link to a calculator and instruction on how you go about figuring out your needs
with cautions for the various tradeoffs involved
what I would expect is for you to come back with a total given by the calculator of the
+3.3V, +5V & +12V rails, along with the various combinations of those and the total watts
information about special use now or later (overclocking, storage array monster, extra stuff like pumps, lights, fans fans fans )
and a question to me regarding do I really need to get a 24 pin main power connector? my mobo has a 20
and do I really need to deduct 1\3rd to 1\2?
possibly even questions regarding the overall thermal solution in the case and how it effects the capacity output of the PSU

:p
 
I think I've settled on the Enermax EG475AX. Good reviews, nice dual +12V rails, enough connectors for my stuff, a cool midnight blue paint job. :D

Does anyone see a problem with this or a better unit they think I should get, or should I go for it?
 
Clownboat said:
Does anyone see a problem with this
Click to expand...

yes
has a main connector that will only see you through to next year
its ATX12V v1.3, you might consider an ATX12V v2.2 and a converter
 
Clownboat said:
Also, the PSU doesn't have to be future-proof ATX 2.2 stuff. I don't plan on upgrading to a PCI-Express capable system anytime soon, so I'd be willing to buy another PSU at that time.
Click to expand...
I don't really feel like spending more and/or dealing with converters. I don't have the money to upgrade every year, and once I do the PSU is going to stay in this computer as it will likely find use elsewhere in my life or in my girlfriend's.

Thanks though. So, is this PSU ok?
 
Im sure without even running the numbers that would meet and exceed the requirements
however Id still recommend running the numbers so you know what kind of expansion\safety margin is there, for that pricepoint pretty much anything is available barring the top end PCP&C's, Redundants and N+1s

in that range you can start to look at the quality of the power, transient response, volatge regulation, ripple

for a real review of that supply
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article149-page1.html

has Voltage Regulation -/+2% on all lines in any nominal combination of loads.
with low and highs at +12V: 11.8 to 12.3, +5V: 4.8 to 5.3, +3.3V: 3.3 to 3.5
an 82% maximum efficiency, which is the 2nd highest Silent Mike has seen
and its relatively quiet,

unfortunately it was reviewed before he implemented the AC regulation scheme he currently employs and no Oscilloscope action for ripple and noise

but thats a real nice PSU (barring its v1.3 :p )
there are a few power supplies that could do better in assorted metrics but there are tradeoffs for that its a nice balance, to actually outclass it youd likely have to jump up the the PCP&C 510
would like to find some info on the transient response and ripple for it though

Ha OK found it (ripple)
this is for the EG701P-VE SFMA its big brother
+3.3V 50mV
+5V 50mV
+12V 1 120mV
+12V 2 120mV
-+5Vsb 50mV

which is pretty good, and likely representative
however that seperate rail spec is a little strange
EG475P-VE SFMA
+12V1..... 1.5A / 33A (MIN/MAX)
+12V2.......0A / 1A

compare that to the
EG701P-VE SFMA
+12V1..... 0.5A / 18A
+12V2......0.5A / 17A

http://www.maxpoint.com/products/pow_supp/spec_pg/425sfma/details.htm
while technically I guess that is a dual rail
it looks like youll be sharing the drives with the CPU to me
might want to research that some more
 
I can't seem to figure out if there's any significant difference between the "P series" the "AX model", i.e. 475AX or 475P.

BTW, thanks for all your help!
 
Clownboat said:
I can't seem to figure out if there's any significant difference between the "P series" the "AX model", i.e. 475AX or 475P.
Click to expand...

Power Factor Correction
which is required in most countries, but not in the US
not a real big consideration, for the quick breakdown
> PFC Decoded @ dansdata

but both the EG475AX-VE & EG475P-VE still have all the Amps on the +12V1 rail
that changes in both lines if you go either down (425) or up (701)
I know that right now your not thinking that your going to be using this in another computer that will be 24 pin, but traditionally a PSU is considered an infrastruture investment, and there are a few other changes that where made in the ATX12V v2.01 Power Design Guide other than just the 20 to 24 pin
(Im going to type out this and cut and paste it later so all of them might not be applicable to this particular supply, like for instance the efficiency)


ATX12V Version 2.0

1.2. Key changes for ATX12V Version 2.0 and Later as Compared with ATX and Previous Versions on ATX12V Power Supply
This section briefly summarizes the major changes made to this document that now defines ATX12V power supply.
With the move to 12V voltage regulators for the processors, ATX guidelines for 5V as mains power are no longer provided

1.2.1. Increased +12 VDC output capability
System components that use 12V are continuing to increase in power.
In cases where expected current requirements is greater than 18A a second 12V rail should be made available.
ATX12V power supplies should be designed at accommodate these increased +12 VDC currents.

1.2.2. Minimum Efficiency
Minimum measured efficiency is required to be 70% at full and typical (-50%) load and 60% at light (-20%) load.
New recommended guidance has been added to provide direction for future requirements.

1.2.3. Main Power Connector
The 2 x 10 main power connector has been replaced by a 2 x 12 connector.
This was made to support 75 watt PCI Express requirements.
Pinout assignments are based on SSI recommendations.
With the added 12V, 5V, and 3.3V pins the need for an Aux Power Connector is no longer needed
and the guidance for this connector has been removed

1.2.4. Seperate current Limit for 12V2 on the 2x2 connector
The 12V rail on the 2 x 2 power connector should be a seperate current limited output to meet the requirements of UL and EN60950

3.2.3. Typical Power Distribution
DC output power requirements and distributions will vary based on specific system options and implementation.
Significant dependencies include the quantity and types of processors, memory, add-in card slots, and peripheral bays,
as well as support for advanced graphics or other features.
It is ultimately the responsibility of the designer to derive a power budget for a given target product and market

Table 3 through Table 5 and figure 1 through Figure 3 provide sample power distributions and graphical recommendations for cross loading.
It should not be inferred that all power supplies must conform to these tables,
nor that a power supply designed to meet the information in these tables will work in all system configurations.

.
ATX350.jpg


ATX400.jpg
Click to expand...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

and for comparision how the Server System Infrastructure (SSI) EPS12V spec calls out the +12V Rails (many supplies meeting both specs with a simple harness change)

6.1.1 12V Power Rail Configuration

There are two types of 12V rail configurations for systems: 'Common plane' and "Split plane' processor power delivery. The 'common plane' system has both processors powered from a single 12V rail (+12V1) from the power supply. The 'split plane' system has both processors powered by seperate 12V rails (+12V1 and +12V2) one dedicated to each processor. The system in both cases, has an additional 12V rail to power the rest of the baseboard +12V loads and dc/dc converters. +12V1, +12V2 and +12V3 should not be connected together on the baseboard to ensure that 240VA protection circuits in the power supply operate properly

Table 6: 12V Rail Summary
........................................................................................................................................................................................
Common Plane System........................................................Split Plane System
+12V1........Processors.........................................................+12V1........Processor 1
+12V2........Baseboard components other than processors.......+12V2........Processor 2
+12V3........Drives and peripherals..........................................+12V3........Baseboards and components other than processors
...........................................................................................+12V4........Drives and peripherals
Click to expand...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

so I checked the manual for that board, and there is no 6 pin auxillary power connector
just the 20 pin main and 4 pin 12V (JWR1 & JPW1) and there is plenty of clearance around the connectors,
so you could use any ATX12V v2 or even EPS12V supply youd like ;)

that Enermax P just makes me nervous with all the Amps on the +12V1
 
good nite, just get the enermax man, it will be fine.
I got the EG485P-VHB for $93, the voltages are right at or slighty above
where they are supposed to be.
 
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