Verizon: We Don't Think You Need 1Gbps

Had mental image of Verizon as Obi Wan waving his hand over those simpleton foot soldiers saying "these aren't the speeds you are looking for" and they let him pass lol.
 
Bigbacon said:
there is truth to this. I mean, on a residential scale, I suspect that most people odn't even need 500mbps or even 100mbps.

Small businesses, unless their business is something that is web based, probably don't need it.

big business might need it.
Click to expand...

Cart before the horse, you build it and they will come. Innovation doesn't happen in a vacuum, example 4k Netflix, great for Europe, not so much for most of us here. What's gonna be the next billion dollar industry? Who knows, the infrastructure is not there to support it.

And I think I would agree with Verizon if they said "no one needs 1Gbps for $500" because that's what they'll likely charge for it. Now if Google sold theirs down here for the $70 asking price then no one in their right mind would stick with Comcrap's 50mbps service for the same price for example.
 
My current backup plans in the house would consume the following if I were to try storing these in cloud over my cable modem AND I could actually get the max speed continuously:

Daily Incremental Backups Average: 7GB = 03:30h to upload
Monthly Full Backups Average: 85GB = 42:30h to upload

Seems reasonable. :rolleyes:
 
500Mb/s is enough for anyone....

Sounds familiar...

"640 k ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates, 1981
 
dandragonrage said:
Those using cloud services for things like backing up their data absolutely can use - and I would argue NEED - 1Gbps service.
Click to expand...

He is talking download speed.
Unless you are restoring something, backups need upload speed, and that's no where near 1Gbps.
 
TwiceOver said:
My ISP doubled my speed from 30 -> 60 for free a few months back. Now I wish they offered a 30/5 package for $30. I don't *need* even as much as I have, and I'd consider myself a heavy user.
Click to expand...

Same here. "Free" upgraded me from 25mb to 50mb, and I'm sure the next year they will be raising the price again. Only cheaper plan is 6mb, which is too slow for any heavy user, and I'm sure why they are keeping it that low.
 
download some of todays newer games on steam. 40+GB, you need 1Gbps internet.
 
I think he's generally correct.....right now


50-100Mbps is fine for now as long as you don't stream 4k content.

4K streaming might push that up to 200-300Mbps. But implementing H.265 will drop that back down.

Bufferbloat is/was a bigger issue that needs addressed.

I couldn't believe the difference implementing fq_codel on my edgerouter made.

The removal of buffer bloat (Load Latency) makes the entire web experience much more enjoyable.


Personally I don't care if my initial backup takes 3 months. As long as each increment gets done in 4-6 hours every night....I have enough bandwidth.

Skirge01 I'm not sure what you do at home, but I'm a Engineer at a 200 person company and we generate 2GB of user data, that needs to be (backed up offsite) retained, every day.


If I were generating 7GB of data a day I would probably install a local backup.....or pay more for faster service if I really needed to retain 7GB of incremental backup data off site.
 
Let's talk upstream rather than total speed or downstream. 100mbps symmetrical would be far more useful to me than 500mbps/3mbps that I'd probably be offered by my cable co.

I feel like being unable to host my own data is becoming a serious security hazard with how lax most companies take digital security, and how likely it is the major content hosts are snooped on by the alphabet agencies. I would love to be able to host my own private (as in I fucking own and physically control the hardware) server on a 100mbps upstream line.
 
I think if we had 1gb speeds, we could see new type of software developed to take advantage of it. However, I don't think I really need this fast service yet at my house. (Not that I would not take it!)
My family usually watches Netflix, HuluPlus, streams for various sources like Pandora or Spotify, plus some web browsing. I have 30 mg service right now and it works out well.
As we move forward with digital distribution for consoles/PC software, some extra speed would be nice. How long does it take to download a BluRay game for a modern console (talking about buying it, not pirating :)). 1 gb would be my 30mg.
As 4K content becomes mainstream, that is going to require additional bandwidth.
 
The big problem is AVAILABILITY.

"We offer 5 exabit connections in Wherethefuckami, Bumblefuckistan (population hovering around 0). And there's no interest!"

They basically roll out to ONE community for this sort of thing, at an insane price premium. Then, when only one hardcore person buys in, they declare "no market for it".

On top of that, in many cases, the retain STUPIDLY small total transfer caps. To the point where someone on a fat enough conection can eat their data cap in under an hour. What's the point of buying an insanely fast connection when you're being told you can only use it 0.06% of the time without being charged EXTRA or have their speed reduced (or both)?

On top of that, a lot of these ISPs are selling you "best effort" connections.

So, if the best the ISP can manage to your particular community is 50 MBit, and you've bought a 100 Mbit connection? Oh well. Best effort!
 
There is also a price consideration. I am quite happy with my 42 Mbps/5 Mbps speeds Uverse service, but I have negotiated a 50% off price cut the last two years. I can get 105 Mbps service with Comcast, but the price isn't worth it.

When I see 1 Gbps speeds in a market, I don't think about what I would do with the higher speeds. I think about those higher speeds hopefully reducing the cost of the lower speed tiers.
 
m heisty said:
Okay, no they do not. Backing up your data takes forever the first time. After that you back up the changes. Why on earth would you need to back up your steam games, or your itunes movies collection? It might take you 2 days to back up everything on a 3mbps up line. But guess what, you don't have to do that every day.
Click to expand...

Unloading the RAW files from my camera generally adds around 8-16GB each time. If I am on a long trip, it can get up to around 32GB.

That takes quite a while to backup on a line that does 5Mb up.

I'd rather it take a few minutes instead of all day.

I'd even settle for a 100/100 line, but the fastest I can even get in my area is 50/10 at over $100 a month. No thanks.

The only service that offers comparable speeds at a slightly lower price (Mediacom), has a stupid bandwidth cap that counts downloads AND uploads towards the cap.
 
The problem here isn't need, yes, not too many residential customers (who aren't trying to run some server at home) do not need 1Gbps. But the key here is value. I don't need 32 rolls of toilet paper all at once either, but I happily buy a big plastic wrapped case of it from CostCo because it has value. Now while I am comparing something tangible to something intangible there still is the side of value to it. You could get a 100Mbps connection from any number of cable companies for anywhere in the neighborhood of $100-130/month , or you could get 1000Mbps from Google Fiber (if you're lucky enough to be in those cities) for $70 a month. Customers might not NEED 1000Mbps, but if I can get 10 times the bandwidth for 50-70% of the cost who isn't going to go there? Then it becomes a matter of comparison, at what price point are you willing to settle for slower speeds? Unless you're a grandma who only uses the internet for email there probably isn't any price point where you'll happily pay less to use less for the simple fact all the other ISPs are too fucking expensive, what's AT&T Uverse go for once you get past the promo period? $40-50 for a 6Mbps line? I'm sorry, I'll pay the extra $30 and increase my bandwidth by a factor of 166.

And the big ISPs fucking know this too, otherwise they wouldn't try to roll out competing (speed) services in the same places Google is looking, they'd simply lower the price on their existing service to actually hit a "middle ground". Sonic is one of the few providers who knows this, granted they have fiber in very few neighborhoods but they offer 1Gbps for 70/month or 100Mbps for 40/month, because (in their words) "Bandwidth is cheap, the cost is running the fiber to each location and maintenance is what costs money" now that's a harder choice (unless you frequent these boards :D), 100Mbps is plenty fast, and $30/month extra does add up. These ISPs, they get it they just make statements like this and pretend they don't.
 
m heisty said:
He is right, however that's a stupid thing to say to the public who has google tell them that they need 1gbps speeds.
Click to expand...

Was thinking the same thing...And I approve of the comment about 4K genitalia.. it's about available bandwidth....this moron thinks we don't need 1Gbps, and yet their FiOS TV service isn't even 1080p, it's 1080i. You don't think we need 1Gbps Internet? Ok fine, then how about you at least give us 1080p. Put it to good use and use it to build out your puny infrastructure and be 4K ready for when those TV's are actually affordable to your paying customers. Don't bother offering Gigabit because we all know how much it will cost -- NOT the $70 a month Google charges I'll tell you that.
 
The way to actually put this is that the average person doesn't need 1Gbps yet. And that is true. They won't use it. Even if you give them 1 Gbps the average family won't use it. After about 20 - 30 Mbps things just kind of don't go much higher. Now in time they might, but right now, people don't have a need for this.

I know of a few companies that set all their customers on fiber to 1Gbps, and none of them have noticed their customers maxing out that connection, most notice about 20 - 30 Mbps and that is it.

Sure you will have a few people like us that would utilize that much more, but for the average person who isn't watching 4k video due to not owning a 4k tv, they an only stream so much at once which after awhile you stream so fast that you buffer it much faster than you can watch it so you are done before you get too far into the show / movie.

so 40 or 50Mbps is going to be overkill for the average person right now. It is still best to be ready for when that swing comes, but as of right now. That need isn't there yet
 
dandragonrage said:
http://store.steampowered.com/news/183/

And no, it isn't a valid counterpoint to say, "but you don't NEED your game immediately; you can wait 2 hours." You could make a similar viewpoint about a lot of technology in the world.
Click to expand...

But even if you were able to find a service to saturate that connection, unless you've got some sort of ridiculous SSD RAID array or are downloading Steam games to a bunch of machines at once, you're not going to be able to write the files to disk at anywhere near 1Gbps.
 
m heisty said:
He is right, however that's a stupid thing to say to the public who has google tell them that they need 1gbps speeds.
Click to expand...

But Google is only saying that because they want to fuck with people. They aren't actually going to give everyone 1Gbps fiber, they are just trying to stir the pot. This is how I see Google right now, they are running a first aid center at a sporting event, they sent people into both sections to start arguments between fans of both teams. Then their guys quickly get out and sit back and watch people get hurt and need their first aid service. They aren't trying to actually build out any of these networks that they have been saying they were going to. They are just trying to make others do it then come up with ways to profit from it.
 
trick0502 said:
download some of todays newer games on steam. 40+GB, you need 1Gbps internet.
Click to expand...

This. If you can drive to the store, purchase the game, drive back, and install it faster than you can download it, then you need faster internet.
 
Since when has it ever been about "Needing" it?

Last I checked businesses were supposed to be providing their customers with what the customer "Wants" not what some random dude thinks they need. Pretty sure I stopped being a child who got told what I needed many years ago. Sure what he says might be technically true, but I would be willing to wager on it coming from him being a greedy asshole more than a technical observation.
 
We also don't need to stream hd content online but I sure as hell want to!
 
The cloud is the future! We can put everything in the cloud!

You don't need 1 GBps. Nothing will use it.

Those can be contradicting. If I have cloud storage, I want to access it fast and get it fast. I don't want 100Mbps. 500Mbps is fine, but why not a full Gb? There are a lot of reasons why 1Gb is excellent. Cloud storage, 4K streaming, huge game downloads, etc..
 
Parja said:
But even if you were able to find a service to saturate that connection, unless you've got some sort of ridiculous SSD RAID array or are downloading Steam games to a bunch of machines at once, you're not going to be able to write the files to disk at anywhere near 1Gbps.
Click to expand...

Uhh... A single HDD can do 1Gbps sequential and has been able to for a few years now, let alone a single SSD or RAID.
 
We got bumped up to 120Mbs recently with Cox, but they didn't do anything with the upload speeds.
so we get 120/12.
the download speeds are great, Origin and Steam will maintain 13MB/s hitting up to 18MB/s occasionally, which makes purchases and updates go very very fast..
 
Ruoh said:
What we need is low latency, no caps, and reasonable speed. 50Mb/50Mb is more than sufficient, if you combined it with low latency. Even the 30/30 fiber at work provided by Comcast blows away my home 100/25 connection when it comes to reliability, stability and latency.
Click to expand...

Since moving from a 20/20 fiber connection to a 150/20 cable provider, my business has only seen an increase in stability in speed. The latency is higher, but not high enough to make a difference. We use many VoIP services including SIP trunks. We have not had a single problem since installing over a year ago.

Even better, we only pay $400/m now instead of $2,000/m for the fiber.
 
51BB6I1EINL._SY300_.jpg


Does this cover it?
 
If you had the capability of 1gb then you be able to find ways to use it. Backups, torrents, file sharing, and downloading HD movies. Everything transfer wise would be better.
 
I currently have Frontier Fios which is 35/35. They are now rolling out 100 Mbit to the home, but they then lower my up to 10 Mbit up. I told them no, I like being able to upload way faster for work, and I really would be ok with 35/100, if I can't get 100/100, but they said not offered. So I'm still rocking the 35/35... My best friend from high school is rocking Condointernet's 100/100, for 40 bucks a month. They offered him 1000/1000 for 80 bucks and he turned them down. I told him he was crazy. :p
 
I'm loving how corporatism went full circle to the point of preaching communist dogma. You don't need more, be happy you're driving a Lada.
 
"everything that can be invented has been invented." and other such nonsense.

Short sighted luddites
 
wgm3446 said:
However, you're looking to stream 4k uncompressed TV.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's not going to happen. 4k at 30fps uncompressed is about 712MB/s, or about 41.65GB per minute. Compressed 4k video will be plenty challenge enough.
 
Bigbacon said:
there is truth to this. I mean, on a residential scale, I suspect that most people odn't even need 500mbps or even 100mbps.

Small businesses, unless their business is something that is web based, probably don't need it.

big business might need it.
Click to expand...

You are VERY VERY wrong. THsi si equavalent ot saying '640k out to be enough for anyone'. 1 GB SYMMETRICAL should be the baseline service for every home. IT costs almost nothing to go from 100mb to 1000mb in terms of transfer costs.
 
m heisty said:
The point is, you do not have to upload your entire back up everyday.
Click to expand...

Why not? We are in over our heads into the INnormation Age. Backing up mutil-GB of data everyday online should be expected and supported. I could blow through a ton of transfer a day jsut swapping security videos between my family's houses.
 
Gweenz said:
No market? I want it. There's your fucking market.
Click to expand...

wanting it and wanting to pay for it are different things. Will you pay $290 per month for 500/500Mbps service today? or about $400 for 1Gbps symentrical?
 
From my understanding 4K is essentially 4x as much data compared to 1080p. I know a Bluray is about 35Mbit/sec. So we'd need roughly 140 Mbit/sec for high quality 4K streaming, on a per stream basis.

Yeah, residential bandwidth needs an improvement.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top