Upgrade Dilemma

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MonkeyGod

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Joined
Jan 16, 2004
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Hello. I'm getting ready to upgrade my computer. I've been wanting to do this for a while now, and have been planning in earnest since early October. I have been doing plenty of research, and have found a lot of helpful information on this site. I am at a point where I feel that I can make an informed decision, but I still have lingering doubts. The system I am planning to build is as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3400+
MSI K8T Neo-FIS2R
1GB Corsair XMS LL (two sticks of 512)
9600XT 128MB (I think I'll do this and upgrade to the r420 later)

Total price at NewEgg is about 1400 with all the other essentials.

I was looking at the Asus 9800XT for a long time, but I have decided that it is probably a good idea to hold off on the high-end video card until HL2 and D3 come out. It basically means spending an "extra" 150 dollars now, but that's acceptable to me.

The problem is that I don't really know if I should wait for the 939's to hit the market. Ideally, waiting should give me a 400mhz difference in speed, dual memory channels, and possibly PCI-Express on the motherboard. However, it means holding off at least until April or July, and probably a month after that to make good parts decisions. I have waited so long to upgrade, and my machine is showing its age alot these days. I'm building this one to last probably about 2 years without a real upgrade (aside from the video card I mentioned). The whole thing may stick around as long as my current one has.

My current system is

P3 Coppermine 800EB @ 833
Abit BE6ii
192MB generic RAM
GeForce2 GTS @ 220/366

So my question is this: is the 939 going to give me a dramatic improvement in the next year? Will I really be able to benefit from that upgrade with the same quality and amount of RAM as I am currently using? And if I wait for these new standards (DDR2, PCI-Express, etc.) how soon will I be seeing definite rewards?
 
Considering top-end DDRII at intro is supposed to be at 533 mhz (we already have some Corsair DDR running at 550) and your current system is so old, I say go ahead if you want the system now, or if you can wait, 939 will be a little better option. Either way, the difference between either socket is going to be so far ahead of what you have I doubt you'll notice the difference
 
longevity? your A64 would hold out for a while. You'll get a boost (about 30 to 40%) whenever WinXP64 gets to the market and people start to realize it's godly and port software to it.
as for me, i just bought my sig system in december. i had wanted a64 for a long time, but realized i could do without it until PCI-Express, DDR2, BTX all go basically mainstream (why in the hell would i really want that)
this way, i can save my pennies for a bit better of a system later on, and still be completely happy now.
 
well if oyu don't upgrade sontantly a a64 will be fine for a while.

if you want to jump on 939 pin fx just get a cheaper barton system with some parts you can upgrade with.
 
I was in a very similar boat. I've been researching forever and have been getting frustrated reading all these posts saying to wait. But I finally broke down and ordered the Athlon64 with the MSI MB and a gig of Corsair low latency XMS RAM.

From what I've read, the PCI express won't be around for a while and it really won't make that much of a difference as most cards don't even really use the 8x AGP to its full capacity. There really is no bottleneck. It'll just have a little different power capabilites. DDR2 will be a while, probably at least Oct. from what I've read.

I ordered 2 sticks of paired RAM so that just in case I do want to upgrade to something with dual channel capabilites I can later. Also, I ordered from Monarch Computers where they put the board, RAM ,and CPU together and test it all out to make sure everything is copacetic (and do it for free). I've read problems that people have with potential bad ram, cpus and boards and thought it'd be a good idea to do. AND the price was excellent! Good for peace of mind.

I say order now.

Here's a link to some questions I asked about DDR2 and PCI express.

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=715850
 
Thanks for the replies folks. They seem to be echoing what I have suspected, which is that buying now will only be nominally less powerful than buying later. Basically I just want to be sure that purchasing this system at this time would not be a foolish decision.
 
What makes you think s939 is going to own s754 so badly? The 3400+ can take the FX-51, can it not?
 
Originally posted by MonkeyGod
I have waited so long to upgrade, and my machine is showing its age alot these days. I'm building this one to last probably about 2 years without a real upgrade (aside from the video card I mentioned). The whole thing may stick around as long as my current one has.
Click to expand...

AMEN BROTHA !!!!!

My current system is

P3 Coppermine 800EB @ 833
Abit BE6ii
192MB generic RAM
GeForce2 GTS @ 220/366
[/B]
Click to expand...

Ive got a
P2 400Mhz
Tyan tsunami mobo 2xAGP
128MB RAM

I would just suggest that you get a 3000+, and plan to get a nice aircooler and OC. your Corsairs should do 220 just fine.

Personally, i went the Mushkin pc3500 Lvl one sticks. Not nearly as well quoted. They supposedly use the same CH-5 chips so. It should be just as good.
 
Personally, I'd get one of the A64 939-pin 90nm SOI chips that are coming this summer for around $200. The 90nm SOI should give insane ocing and you'll get the extras like dual-channel and PCI-Express.
 
Argh. I'm so confused. I see valid points on both sides, and I have to say that I've wrestled with these very issues for at least a few weeks now. One of my limiting factors is that I am a student, and until I am employed and financially stable (hopefully within a year) I have to be careful with my money. I'm not sure I really want to buy things now and then buy more stuff 6 months into the future. Already I changed my original 9800xt plan to a 9600xt ($350 less, money that can be used to buy a much nicer card when I truly want it for HL2 or D3), and then to a 9700pro ($50 more than the 9600 for double the speed, and an easy oc to approach 9800 speeds). Now, if I buy myself a 64 3000+ or an XP system, im saving about $200-300 immediately, with an expected cost of about $350 to $400 on the 939 processor and motherboard in 6 months (I plan to go with the best non-FX cpu I can get)... add to that the $300-$400 video card, and I'm looking at about $800 later in the year. Yes, I will be spending a quite bit on components that will be expensive for 3-4 months and then drop, but that is because I want to start out with a screamer. Who knows how long it will be before I can really do any upgrading at all.

If I go the 3000+ route (an attractive option), ultimately I spend 1900 to 2000 instead of 1700. Keep in mind that my funds decrease constantly when I'm not working, which is pretty much any time other than Summer. I realize an XP system would be alot cheaper, but then I haven't done much research on that setup. I also haven't got enough oc'ing experience to really max out the efficiency on that type of system. I'm not saying I can't learn, and I plan to tweak things anyway. It just means a bit more work for me in the short term.

Really this whole decision is so hard to because I know there are cheap and efficient ways to get a nice system without going 64. I want a new system very much, and the waiting would probably get to me before April, so either way I'd prefer to buy something now. I know that patience is a very strong asset when it comes to computer building. I'm just sort of running low these days.

I hope it doesn't look like I'm making excuses and just looking for external justification for buying the system. I do not want to overlook an option that would allow me to have good speed now and great speed later.

I guess that buying a new cpu/mobo in 6 months for about 400 isn't all that bad. It is the miser in me vs. the I want a badass computer now because it has been 6 years (yes 1998) since I bought a new machine side. I'm sure you're all familiar with that voice. :p

Thanks for your input everyone. It helps getting feedback from other people, even if half the posts conflict with the other half. :D
 
if your set on an A64 rig then go for it. I would definatly buy the 3000+ the 3400+ is way too exensive for the amount of preofrmance you gain.

If you want a cheaper system you could go with a 2500+ then upgrade mobo and cpu when you need to.
 
I'd say buy now. There is always something around the corner in the computer industry that could be worth waiting for. If you continually waited for the next best thing, you'd never upgrade.

I just bought a FX-51, SK8V and Corsair reg RAM. It cost a fortune and will be obsolete within 2 months. I don't really care as it is fast as hell and does what I want it to do now. I'll worry about upgrading later.
 
I'm really sick of the people who say their new System with the latest scream in technology will be obsolete in a few months...
What the hell is your problem, i have a P4 1.3 FSB 100 Mhz and a GeForce 4 MX400 (yes i fell on the 4 hype big time) and I just ran Vice City quite well, if i had a better vid card i would get better img quality but the proc holds.

What really matters in gaming is the VID CARD PERIOD, everything else will hold no matter how OUT OF FASHION it may seem.

Thats why i'm getting a barton 2500+ OCing it to 3200+ and will sleep fine knowing that no matter how many HL2 they throw at me I can always get a new VID Card...

But thats just me....
 
most games don't even recommend a 1.5ghz processor or greater. Few even require a 1 ghz processor. Now doom 3 will needa 2 ghz proc as a requirement (maybe that's recommended) but not everyone programs like that
 
Guys, recommendations are quite frankly, shit. They aren't very well done. Most of the time if you get everything that is asked for, you're game will still lag.

Video card isn't the only thing you need for gaming, are you crazy? Go put a 9800pro in a Pentium 3 with SDram and see if you can run UT2003 at decent framerates. You're computer parts need to be in balance, you can't let a slow CPU or ram speed drag that expensive video card down. But right now, if you get say a 2500+, 512mb of DDR400 and a 9800 or 9600 even you will be okay for games for at least a little while more.
 
i know it doesn't mean you will play it excellently but it is something to base how good your system is and how long it will last.

If your system is about 2x the requirement you're alright. If 2x the recommendation then your sitting pretty.
 
I still differ from most people here.
Most of the data processed during gaming goes to the GPU, not the CPU. Only games like Battlefield 1942 are starting to use more heavily the CPU and even after that its not that heavy of a load.

Ever wondered why the timing on the memory in the GPU is so high, it moves more data per clock than the CPU does, thats why they call them graphich intensive games.

I don't mean to tell you to dust off your old celeron, put a radeon on it and go play HALO, but something like a barton 2500+ OCed to 3200+ with the asus or abit mobo on it, the whole package under $200 will enough time.

I don't see anyway to justify the purchase of those Athlon64, first because of the premium AMD charges over technology in hardware that is not still implemented in software.

Then if you look at the pentium side of the issue, the only sane purchase right now would be the P4 2.4c or 2.6, and OCing the crap out of it. And still you would be spending a $100 more on the proc and mobo.

I'll stop ranting now....
 
Originally posted by chinoquezada
I'm really sick of the people who say their new System with the latest scream in technology will be obsolete in a few months...
What the hell is your problem, i have a P4 1.3 FSB 100 Mhz and a GeForce 4 MX400 (yes i fell on the 4 hype big time) and I just ran Vice City quite well, if i had a better vid card i would get better img quality but the proc holds.

What really matters in gaming is the VID CARD PERIOD, everything else will hold no matter how OUT OF FASHION it may seem.

Thats why i'm getting a barton 2500+ OCing it to 3200+ and will sleep fine knowing that no matter how many HL2 they throw at me I can always get a new VID Card...

But thats just me....
Click to expand...


My problem is spending 3x the system price on a gfx card. Myself (and many others) don't only play games on their PC's....we actually use them for work :rolleyes:. To me, spending the extra cash on the system is money well spent....money that I will more than likely get back when I come to upgrade 2 months down the line to the next "big thing". The faster my work gets done, the more money I earn.
 
That's why you never buy the very high-end. You always buy one level below that like the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro, not the ATI Radeon 9800XT. This is also why I don't recommend buying an A64 right now, as the platform is only beginning to mature and progress. A Barton 2500+ @ 2.2gHz or beyond paired w/ a 9800 Pro WILL run Doom3 and HL2 decent.
 
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