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R520 and ATI 'SLI' details begin to emerge
- Thread starter ThomasE66
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MeanieMan said:Rumor says any chipset that supports 2 pci-x16 slots.
It's possible, but unlikely,,,
Unless they manage to make this purely driver/Software...
which would be cool
Also, if ATIs attitude towards OCing is any factor recently (like how they sponsored that OC show in texas) then the R520s should be good OCers (Hopefully)
Hate_Bot said:
Purely driver/software has been done before. In fact it was done first.
I'm just connecting the "rumors" and so far its pointing to a setup similiar to X2. When X2 was competing againist SLI a common statement from alienware was that their setup didn't require PCB, since the hub wasn't considered that.
USMC2Hard4U
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But my biggest question is... is it REQUIRED for me to have an ATi Chipset to use their cards in SLI...
or will any Chipset do
or will any Chipset do
USMC2Hard4U
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Nothing is wrong with an ATi Chipset.. espically the one that they just announced however... When building an Intel system... I like to sitck with Intel Chipsets.... just my prefereanceHate_Bot said:
mohammedtaha
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Well I'm assuming they're gonna use the Sapphire Motherboard with the ATi chipset. Although this one in particular does not have 2 pci-e x 16 slots
I won't be surprised if Sapphire also designs white pcb's for the new cards.
That would kill all sales of every other motherboard and video card company !!
I won't be surprised if Sapphire also designs white pcb's for the new cards.
That would kill all sales of every other motherboard and video card company !!
mohammedtaha said:Well I'm assuming they're gonna use the Sapphire Motherboard with the ATi chipset. Although this one in particular does not have 2 pci-e x 16 slots
I won't be surprised if Sapphire also designs white pcb's for the new cards.
That would kill all sales of every other motherboard and video card company !!
http://img128.exs.cx/img128/8915/sap5s5nb.jpg
[IMG]http://img128.exs.cx/img128/897/sap3s1xj.jpg
[IMG]http://img128.exs.cx/img128/9179/sap2s0ff.jpg[/QUOTE]
Or...you could have just posted a link to the post you took these images from.
[URL=http://vspx27.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/main.py?qtype=userpage&teamnum=33&username=MeanieMan][IMG]http://www.mentallyretired.com/h3/index.cfm/u_127431[/URL]
mohammedtaha
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MeanieMan said:Or...you could have just posted a link to the post you took these images from.
and use up the sites bandwidth ?
mohammedtaha
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must be that time of the month ? 
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=55734&page=1&pp=25
back to topic
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=55734&page=1&pp=25
back to topic
MeanieMan said:Or...you could have just posted a link to the post you took these images from.
whats the diffrence?
There thumbnaisl btw, you can click them to make them bigger, if thats what your talking about resizing
And stealing other peoples bandwith isn't good.
Erasmus354
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USMC2Hard4U said:
Intel is never going to make a dual PCI-E graphics motherboard, they simply aren't interested in devoting any time/money to the enthusiast market (beyond converting server chips into "EXTREME EDITION ROXORZ ULTIMATE CPU RAWR!!")
I dont think you will be able to use ATi's solution for dual cards on anything but their chipset for dual graphics cards, this seems to have already been exhibited by the Asus MVP board which was accidentally shown at CES, and it makes sense too. A purely software solution (which is what would be required to use any motherboard) would likely place a decent load on the CPU, which is exactly what you dont want when you are gaming (and if your not gaming you have no use for SLI or MVP in the first place.
The only problem with using an ATi chipset atm is that ATi has not fixed the problems with their southbridge yet, but they will before they release any motherboards with it I am sure.
I'm getting two conflicting ideas in my head now (and pardon the ranting, raving tone):
Remember the Gigabyte 915 "SLI" motherboard? (Note the quotes around SLI)
Upside: Intel chipset+AMR/whatever
Downside: All this stuff I keep hearing about Intel 900 chipsets not supplying the full 8GB/s of bandwidth to x16 slots- instead of 4/4, nVidia says 3/1. Let's see if ATI has anything to say about this.
If we use NV's SLI bridge as an approximation, the cards will need about 1GB/s of dedicated bandwidth to communicate with each other. If the 3/1 rumors are true, the cards may take an automatic hit on this implementation. Then again, 2.5GB+/0.5GB- still isn't bad (assuming 1GB/s is split 50/50).
OTOH, I don't know how the x4 slot off the southbridge acts- like a true x4 slot according to the PCIe specs, or like 1/4 of Intel's x16 slot, meaning 1GB+/.25GB-
I'm using the GB board as an example, since I suspect that other manufacturers will copy the design (maybe even as a budget board!) if they get ATI's solution to work on it.
Remember the Gigabyte 915 "SLI" motherboard? (Note the quotes around SLI)
Upside: Intel chipset+AMR/whatever
Downside: All this stuff I keep hearing about Intel 900 chipsets not supplying the full 8GB/s of bandwidth to x16 slots- instead of 4/4, nVidia says 3/1. Let's see if ATI has anything to say about this.
If we use NV's SLI bridge as an approximation, the cards will need about 1GB/s of dedicated bandwidth to communicate with each other. If the 3/1 rumors are true, the cards may take an automatic hit on this implementation. Then again, 2.5GB+/0.5GB- still isn't bad (assuming 1GB/s is split 50/50).
OTOH, I don't know how the x4 slot off the southbridge acts- like a true x4 slot according to the PCIe specs, or like 1/4 of Intel's x16 slot, meaning 1GB+/.25GB-
I'm using the GB board as an example, since I suspect that other manufacturers will copy the design (maybe even as a budget board!) if they get ATI's solution to work on it.
Hate_Bot said:
Ahh man, how can you not love Hate_Bot? Someone disagrees with him and he can't even figure out that they were saying he's wrong.
Hate_Bot, do you not understand the meaning of the term "Actual" and how using it when something is "Equivalent" is wrong?
Lets use the above terms to re-write what the article said, then look again at what you said....
What the Article said: "The card ACTUALLY has 24 pipelines, but they are EQUIVALENT to 32 pipelines by todays standards."
What you said: "The card has 32 ACTUAL pipelines."
What you meant: "The card will perform like it has 32 pipelines."
Things like this are what makes it so fun, but fustrating, to debate with you Hate_Bot. You can read something and understand it, and yet when you actually talk about it you somehow manage to say something close to the truth, but ultimately completely wrong. Makes for a good time though, and that's why you gotta love Hate_Bot.
From the Article -
How does he multiply 24 by 1.5 and get 32? I know that at least here in Seattle 24*1.5 almost always works out to 36. Maybe all the overheated brains of all the programming geniuses at Cebit warp reality until math works completely differently.
How does he multiply 24 by 1.5 and get 32? I know that at least here in Seattle 24*1.5 almost always works out to 36. Maybe all the overheated brains of all the programming geniuses at Cebit warp reality until math works completely differently.
Erasmus354
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MeanieMan said:Intel was the first with a dual pci-x16 motherboard. Alienware showcased it with its X2 at E3.
Its also not really about the motherboard, but more about the chipset.
I believe that was more Alienware designing a dual PCI-E motherboard around an Intel chipset rather than Intel making a dual PCI-E motherboard.
quick question that might seem odd.
They said that a single R520 is twice the speed of the fastest X850 (X850XT-PE)
Since in X850XT-PE (In terms of just raw power) is faster then an Ultra, then wouldn't a single R520 be faster then Dual Ultras? Even if having dual Ultras means twice the performance?
This is exactly what I meant. I saud "The card has 32 current pipelines" what I meant was that it had 32 pipelines in the context of the pipelines were talking about when we talk about current cards. So the card has say twice the pipelines of an X800XL, and not 8 more.
They said that a single R520 is twice the speed of the fastest X850 (X850XT-PE)
Since in X850XT-PE (In terms of just raw power) is faster then an Ultra, then wouldn't a single R520 be faster then Dual Ultras? Even if having dual Ultras means twice the performance?
arentol said:Ahh man, how can you not love Hate_Bot? Someone disagrees with him and he can't even figure out that they were saying he's wrong.
Hate_Bot, do you not understand the meaning of the term "Actual" and how using it when something is "Equivalent" is wrong?
Lets use the above terms to re-write what the article said, then look again at what you said....
What the Article said: "The card ACTUALLY has 24 pipelines, but they are EQUIVALENT to 32 pipelines by todays standards."
What you said: "The card has 32 ACTUAL pipelines."
What you meant: "The card will perform like it has 32 pipelines."
Things like this are what makes it so fun, but fustrating, to debate with you Hate_Bot. You can read something and understand it, and yet when you actually talk about it you somehow manage to say something close to the truth, but ultimately completely wrong. Makes for a good time though, and that's why you gotta love Hate_Bot.
This is exactly what I meant. I saud "The card has 32 current pipelines" what I meant was that it had 32 pipelines in the context of the pipelines were talking about when we talk about current cards. So the card has say twice the pipelines of an X800XL, and not 8 more.
USMC2Hard4U
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Competetion is good for all. I do hope Nvidia comes out with a good stong competetor for the R520 so that will for the prices down to better levels for all of us...
I dont have a prefrance between ATi or Nvidia... whatever card is faster for the time... same with Intel and AMD.... whatever is faster at the time.
But 2005 looks like a GREAT year for all hardware its about time
I dont have a prefrance between ATi or Nvidia... whatever card is faster for the time... same with Intel and AMD.... whatever is faster at the time.
But 2005 looks like a GREAT year for all hardware
its about time 
mustang_steve
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Jasonx82 said:No No, Your Computer wont boot cuz not enuff power...
Bah! That's when you go for real power supplies....I can see it now, a 1200w industrial PSU with it's own dual watercooling loop just so the sound of a 190CFM 120mm fan won't kill your ears....pure ownage right there, that's all I gotta say!
....or we could just hope to god computers can be fitted with some kind of heat to electricity gizmo, if one that doesn't suck is ever made....
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TheFury said:
There have been alot of rumors as to what nVidia has been working on lately since they chose not to spend time on doing a refresh this spring like ATI did with the X850's but you can be sure that nVidia will most likely have a strong competitor that could be as fast or faster then this new R520 from ATI.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=874360
I sorta look for nVidia to possibly come out with something more innovative then the current implementation of SLI.
Playstation 3 will be using the new Cell microprocessor thats being developed by IBM/Sony/Toshiba which has the possibility to change CPU's as we know them forever if it performs as well as they claim. There is also the new PPU (Physics Processing Unit) that will greatly advance physics and AI in next generation games. nVidia will most likely have a real winner for PS3, or so we hope.
I wish nVidia and ATI would work togethor on the whole SLI/AMR thing though because its stupid to have to buy different motherboards for different video cards. ATI is not exactly the top ranked chipset manufacturer out there ither and i would much rather have an Intel or nVidia based chipset then an ATI. There is alot more to a motherboard chipset then just providing graphics capabilities.
SnowBeast
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Hate_Bot said:
Damn. I called it in a thread a few weeks ago here and rage3d. The whole 24 pipes didn't make sense. Speciallly dropping down to .09 fab. Every top of the line card from 2 pipes to 16 has doubled on new architecture.(R200-4,R300-8,R420-16,R520-32 pipes.)
This owns. Wish I could get a PCI-E and couple of 520's this year.
Oh well. Car and kid is first... SnowBeast said:Damn. I called it in a thread a few weeks ago here and rage3d. The whole 24 pipes didn't make sense. Speciallly dropping down to .09 fab. Every top of the line card from 2 pipes to 16 has doubled on new architecture.(R200-4,R300-8,R420-16,R520-32 pipes.)
This owns. Wish I could get a PCI-E and couple of 520's this year.
See, this is what I am talking about Hate_Bot. This guy reads your statement that it has "32 actual pipes", and now he honestly believes it has 32 ACTUAL PHYSICAL PIPES, even though the article CLEARLY states it has 24 ACTUAL PHYSICAL PIPES. SnowBeast is now going to go all over the internet posting about how he was right when he said it would have 32 pipes, and how awesome he is to have guessed it. Then lots of other people are going to listen to him (even though people like me will be posting just after him saying he is wrong), and it's going to get spread all over hell and back simply because YOU typed actual when you should have typed something like "equivalent".
You know what SnowBeasts post is proof of. It's proof that your statement was MISLEADING. You didn't lie. You weren't intentionally trying to mislead people, but you managed to mislead people because you used a term that was not correct for the meaning you intended it to convey.
And the worst part is you totally understand the article, and what it meant, and yet you apparently have such a warped understanding of the english language that you still can't understand why it is COMPLETELY and UTTERLY wrong to say "actual" when you mean "equivalent".
So I ask you.... Can you NOW see why it was very misleading to say actual?
USMC2Hard4U
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For the Record and Clairification so people dont have to bounce all around the post.
R520 will have 24 Accual physical Pipelines. They will just have the performance of "32" Pipes due to the technology it uses.
Its just the the P4 with HT. Its not 2 CPU's but it "acts" like 2 CPUs....
R520 will have 24 Accual physical Pipelines. They will just have the performance of "32" Pipes due to the technology it uses.
Its just the the P4 with HT. Its not 2 CPU's but it "acts" like 2 CPUs....
mohammedtaha
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USMC2Hard4U said:
dammit homie .. proof read ?
USMC2Hard4U
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mohammedtaha said:
C'mon im a Marine, I suck at stuff like readingOn our claymore mines on the explosive side it says "Point this side at enemy"
We arent the smartest people
mohammedtaha
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if that truly is your location .. Iraq .. then I understand ..
btw .. how's the food ? Have you had any Middle Easter food as of yet ?
btw .. how's the food ? Have you had any Middle Easter food as of yet ?
USMC2Hard4U
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Yeah I am deployed to Iraq right now until August ish time frame. Sold my PC so I am wating and saving all this money to spend about 6Gs on a computer + monitor when I come back
Only have ate what they feed me at the chow hall, most american food good fried chicken and hamburgers alot
Only have ate what they feed me at the chow hall, most american food
good fried chicken and hamburgers alot TheLonelySwedish
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You definitely misunderstood SnowBeast's post. He said that he was suprised that ATi had not doubled it's "actual" pipes as it has in every other graphics card release. Please, stop flaming and read. Thanks.arentol said:
Props to ATi on this one....2005 will be a crazy year for gaming.
TheLonelySwedish said:
SnowBeasts statement could be interpreted 2 ways....
SnowBeast said:
You could read it as: DAMN I was wrong when I called 32 pipes a few weeks ago. I though 24 pipes didn't make sense because of the drop to a lower fab and ATI's history of doubling pipes in each new architecture.
Or you could read it as: DAMN I was right! I called 32 actual pipes a few weeks ago. 24 pipes didn't make sense with the drop to a lower fab and the previous doubling of pipes in each new architecture.
I of course interpreted it the second way and you the first.
While there is no proof either of our interpretations is right, I do think mine is a tad stronger for two reasons... Because he specifically quoted the "32 actual pipes" statement, and because of what he said in the second paragraph....
He says "This owns", a positive reinforcement of the card, which is exactly what someond would say if they thought they were right. If someone was agreeing they were wrong and wanted to say the card was still good then they would probably say something like "This card STILL owns".
Regardless, the "32 actual pipelines" is clearly just adding to our confusion over someone elses post. Without that misleading statement hanging out there we wouldn't even need to be talking about this.
So are they aren't planning on making an AGP solution for the 520? This SUCKS. And Nvidia is just recycling the same thing, but in SLI.
I just bought a shuttle SN95G5 which I bought less than 2 months ago and would rather not have to put in an x800 (I'm using a 9600Pro because I was waiting for next gen cards).
*crosses fingers for AGP, 1 slot solution*
I just bought a shuttle SN95G5 which I bought less than 2 months ago and would rather not have to put in an x800 (I'm using a 9600Pro because I was waiting for next gen cards).
*crosses fingers for AGP, 1 slot solution*