"Old" laptop is running sloooooowly

T

tvih

Gawd
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
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I have a Fujitsu-Siemens Amilo 2540 (or something like that... dual-core Turion 64, 2GB RAM and so forth) laptop. It's.... 4 years old or thereabouts I believe. I gave it to my mother two years ago, and then now took it back after it started "malfunctioning".

The problem is that it works very slowly these days. I'm not sure what's up. It seems the CPU sometimes/often stays throttled down even when CPU usage is at 100%. This happens in both Linux and Windows, and thus points to a non-OS-related problem. The CPU runs quite hot a lot of the time, but then it always did that. I checked the fan as well, and cleaned it and all that, but it made no difference. Even blasted it with an external tabletop fan which lowered the temps but did nothing for the speed at which the computer functions.

Though I must say that even when the CPU does work at "proper" speeds, the machine as a whole still feels a lot more sluggish than what it used to be, even after a fresh reinstall of Windows, or running Linux that never got bloated to begin with since it was mostly a test install to try and diagnose if it'd make a difference.

So I'm wondering if there's anything to be done? I don't really have any specific use in mind for the computer seeing as these days I already have my main comp, secondary HTPC-ish comp and a netbook, but of course it'd be nice to still have that laptop functioning properly as well. But I must say I'm out of ideas on what to do.
 
When you cleaned the fan, did you replacethe thermal material between the CPU and it's heatsink? That can dry out and become become a thermal insulator and cause the CPU to throttle from overheating.
 
Have you checked the hard drive? My ultraportable Vaio TZ had been performing extremely slow as of late (slower than usual). I found out that the hard drive is dying, having many bad sectors.
 
More than likely the hard drive. Laptops from this time typically had very slow HDD's. Not to mention its very likely performing under par from bad sectors.

I'm currently posting from an old Acer Aspire 5100 (5 years old) and its running very fast for what it is. I've upgraded from TL-50 to TL-60 and went from 1GB to 2GB but the real difference came in when I upgraded the turd slow 4200 RPM HDD with an SSD. Unfortunately this one is stuck with PATA but even still I saw about a 200% increase in performance and load times.
 
I was thinking HDD too. I've got a convertible tablet PC - HP TX2 - with a dual core Turion in it (and 6GB of RAM). The stock 5400 RPM 320GB HDD was super-crap-slow at times.

Dropped an 80gb Intel X25-m in there and it feels like a new machine. Huge difference.
 
tvih said:
IIt seems the CPU sometimes/often stays throttled down even when CPU usage is at 100%. This happens in both Linux and Windows, and thus points to a non-OS-related problem.
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Check your temperatures and clock frequency, use a tool like HWmonitor and cpuz
http://www.cpuid.com/softwares.html and see what temps and clocks its reporting. Post back to us.

What proccess in windows and linux is using up most of your cpu?

Have you tried doing a fresh reinstall despite the fact that problem shows up in two different OS's?
 
ryan_975 said:
When you cleaned the fan, did you replacethe thermal material between the CPU and it's heatsink? That can dry out and become become a thermal insulator and cause the CPU to throttle from overheating.
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No, I didn't disassemble it that far. However like I said, lowering the temps didn't even help.

serpretetsky said:
Check your temperatures and clock frequency, use a tool like HWmonitor and cpuz http://www.cpuid.com/softwares.html and see what temps and clocks its reporting. Post back to us.

What proccess in windows and linux is using up most of your cpu?

Have you tried doing a fresh reinstall despite the fact that problem shows up in two different OS's?
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I have uses such tools, which is why I know the speeds were unusual to begin with. Most of the time the clock frequency stayed at 800MHz, which is the lowest the thing clocks itself down to. Temps were something like 50-80 degrees under stress, depending on "external assistance", but like I said it always ran hot even as brand new - a common problem.

And like I also mentioned, yes, I did reinstall Windows too :p What is using the CPU the most also of course depends on what I happen to be doing. If surfing the web, on that particular computer Adobe Flash for some reason kicks the CPU right up to 100% usage, which combined to it staying at 800MHz really makes it crawl. My mother plays copious amounts of Farmville (*shudder*) so you can imagine she wasn't very happy with the performance once it started dropping.

--

As for all the comments about the HDD... it can be to blame for the other kind of sluggishness like with the horrid sloading times and such, but not for the CPU staying clocked down. If I can't solve the CPU problem, there's no point in even trying to solve the HDD problem (which shouldn't be much of a problem, really, it's easily swappable). After all when it's slow without even much HDD activity (with whatever you're using already loaded up etc), it'll be slow no matter what HDD you put in.
 
tvih said:
No, I didn't disassemble it that far. However like I said, lowering the temps didn't even help.


I have uses such tools, which is why I know the speeds were unusual to begin with. Most of the time the clock frequency stayed at 800MHz, which is the lowest the thing clocks itself down to. Temps were something like 50-80 degrees under stress, depending on "external assistance", but like I said it always ran hot even as brand new - a common problem.

And like I also mentioned, yes, I did reinstall Windows too :p What is using the CPU the most also of course depends on what I happen to be doing. If surfing the web, on that particular computer Adobe Flash for some reason kicks the CPU right up to 100% usage, which combined to it staying at 800MHz really makes it crawl. My mother plays copious amounts of Farmville (*shudder*) so you can imagine she wasn't very happy with the performance once it started dropping.

--

As for all the comments about the HDD... it can be to blame for the other kind of sluggishness like with the horrid sloading times and such, but not for the CPU staying clocked down. If I can't solve the CPU problem, there's no point in even trying to solve the HDD problem (which shouldn't be much of a problem, really, it's easily swappable). After all when it's slow without even much HDD activity (with whatever you're using already loaded up etc), it'll be slow no matter what HDD you put in.
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CPU staying clocked down is a sign of thermal throttling. How are you checking the temps, and what sensors are you actually reading? You said temps were lower, but how much lower?
 
ryan_975 said:
CPU staying clocked down is a sign of thermal throttling. How are you checking the temps, and what sensors are you actually reading? You said temps were lower, but how much lower?
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Yes, that's what I thought. However, lower was 50 degrees with external cooler blowing into it, and 75-80 or so without. Same throttling issue in both cases. I didn't do the temp check recently, the computer's been sitting idle for a month at least, but I did the same test in both Linux and Windows with "goal-appropriate" software (I've used various such software before, can't remember what it was that time). Results were the same in both cases.
 
Well it's not like I have replacement part for it, plus since the problem doesn't go away with a lower temperature based on my test.....
 
tvih said:
Well it's not like I have replacement part for it, plus since the problem doesn't go away with a lower temperature based on my test.....
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lower temperature according to what sensors in which software? If you're looking to us for help with this issue, you need to be as specific as you can about what steps you've taken and what tools you've used to troubleshoot your problem.

I still suggest replacing the thermal paste on the processor and see if that helps.
 
The specific software matters sod all, especially given I've already checked with more than one. I know how to check temps whether it's a desktop or laptop, it's not exactly rocket science. I wouldn't be asking here if the solution was something that simple. After nearly 20 years with computers, I'm not exactly new at this.
 
tvih said:
The specific software matters sod all, especially given I've already checked with more than one. I know how to check temps whether it's a desktop or laptop, it's not exactly rocket science. I wouldn't be asking here if the solution was something that simple. After nearly 20 years with computers, I'm not exactly new at this.
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Well, good luck then. You seem to have it all under control.
 
If you didn't even replace the thermal paste on the thing, you can't claim anything about lower temps. The whole intention for it is heat transference. If the heat isn't being properly transferred to the heatsink, the die heats up quickly. Though you may be cooling it down, it might not be getting cooled fast enough.

Also to note, you just stated you have no idea what condition the CPU is in as you didn't even remove the heatsink. It could have easily been damaged from overheating before you even got your hands on it. It being damaged might be the reason why it isn't working properly.
 
ryan_975 said:
Well, good luck then. You seem to have it all under control.
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The reason I rarely ask anything in Internet forums is most of the people seem to reply on the assumption that "this guy is asking for help - therefore he's clearly clueless", which certainly rubs me the wrong way. More than that, the majority apparently usually don't even read the OP or further replies properly, or they wouldn't always be asking me things I had already pre-emptively addressed.

ZYFER said:
If you didn't even replace the thermal paste on the thing, you can't claim anything about lower temps. The whole intention for it is heat transference. If the heat isn't being properly transferred to the heatsink, the die heats up quickly. Though you may be cooling it down, it might not be getting cooled fast enough.
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Seeing as the heat sensors aren't on the heatsink (if they were, they'd be useless)... yes, I can say something about the temps, since the CPU itself runs less hot with external fans in use and therefore the heatsink obviously transfers the heat as well. Of course it may have been damaged by heat while my mother was using it, but it seems unlikely given the CPU's downthrottling if it does get too hot (whether or not this is now happening because of that) and also runs the fan at higher RPM when needed (something it doesn't do all the time, so it considers the temps "normal" apparently).

Obviously I can replace the thermal paste, probably will too given it's not a big operation and certainly doesn't hurt to try, but I honestly don't expect it to make much of a difference, if any at all.
 
i'll run under the assumption your temperature are indeed accurate enough. Those temps seem fine, so I'm not sure why it would throttle down. Have you already been poking through your bios? Nothing about cpu thermal throttling, maximum cpu power state, or intel speedstep that looks irregular?

What happens if you go into windows control panel and under power options force the cpu to be at a mininum of 100%. Does that do anything?
 
tvih said:
The reason I rarely ask anything in Internet forums is most of the people seem to reply on the assumption that "this guy is asking for help - therefore he's clearly clueless", which certainly rubs me the wrong way. More than that, the majority apparently usually don't even read the OP or further replies properly, or they wouldn't always be asking me things I had already pre-emptively addressed.
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Except you haven't addressed them. All you did was say "temps are lower, doesn't matter what software I'm using, or what steps I've taken. I know what I'm doing, so you're wrong." You never elaborated on whether the software you're using is just reading temps from a motherboard sensor whcih may or may not even be near the CPU, or within the CPU die itself.
 
serpretetsky said:
i'll run under the assumption your temperature are indeed accurate enough. Those temps seem fine, so I'm not sure why it would throttle down. Have you already been poking through your bios? Nothing about cpu thermal throttling, maximum cpu power state, or intel speedstep that looks irregular?
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There were no controls in the BIOS for any of that unfortunately, can't really change anything there. Which sucks.

What happens if you go into windows control panel and under power options force the cpu to be at a mininum of 100%. Does that do anything?
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I'm fairly certain I tried that, and it didn't stay at 100%. Right now I took the computer apart, but can't find my thermal paste so can't put it back together, and therefore can't retest yet.

ryan_975 said:
You never elaborated on whether the software you're using is just reading temps from a motherboard sensor whcih may or may not even be near the CPU, or within the CPU die itself.
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I really don't want to sound ungrateful to people trying to help, but... you could just assume I took the right readings, you know, in which case further elaboration isn't necessary ;) They are indeed from the CPU sensors... and of course there's the GPU and chipset sensors in addition. When in doubt it's generally easy enough to find out what is what, simply by stressing that component specifically. The Linux software I monitored with... well hell, I can't even remember the name since I only installed it specifically for the occasion, but the GUI was in the Gnome taskbar. It specifically listed CPU sensors, for example. In Windows I used either Everest, Speccy, or both. Across all software I used the results were the same, in any case. And of course I'll be retesting once I put the computer back together.

If the CPU continues to act wonky after that, I might try taking the Turion 64 X2 CPU from my brother's laptop which has a broken SATA connector for the HDD and is thus unused, but other components work fine.
 
Not asking a lot, just that some people go through all the steps. Can't assume the heat sensor is working perfectly fine, as I have seen some be off as much as 10 degrees. Though the software might bring back similar results, we cannot assume the information fed to the software is accurate. How does the CPU look btw? Normally in laptops there is at least some sign of overheating, but did you notice anything in particular?

But seeing as you have a spare processor to work with, those steps would be similar as to what I'd take as well. We can't assume it is not a motherboard problem, as in laptops they easily take more abuse due to being carried around, drops, spilled on, sweat over, etc. But always good to go through all the steps :)

Your bro's laptop isn't completely useless anyways, can use it with Linux and an external drive. Makes for a basic enough desktop for doing whatever!
 
ZYFER said:
Can't assume the heat sensor is working perfectly fine, as I have seen some be off as much as 10 degrees. Though the software might bring back similar results, we cannot assume the information fed to the software is accurate. How does the CPU look btw? Normally in laptops there is at least some sign of overheating, but did you notice anything in particular?
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Well, the heat sensors can be malfunctioning of course, but I have no way of personally monitoring the temperature any other way. However as the temperature reading does still react to load/fan speed changes so while it might be somewhat inaccurate, I doubt it's actually malfunctioning in that sense. And I guess chances are if it is inaccurate now, it was inaccurate to begin with.

No visible damage on the CPU, in fact it looks basically new after I removed the old thermal paste!

But seeing as you have a spare processor to work with, those steps would be similar as to what I'd take as well. We can't assume it is not a motherboard problem, as in laptops they easily take more abuse due to being carried around, drops, spilled on, sweat over, etc. But always good to go through all the steps :)
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Ran into a major hiccup with the spare processor though... unlike I recalled, it's apparently an AMD Athlon 64 X2 QL-60 (AMQL60DAM22GG), not a Turion, while the one in mine is an AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 (TMDTL60HAX5DC). The former is socket S1G2, while latter is S1G1... so I guess chances are the swap will not work based on what I've googled on the subject :( Some say G1 will work on G2 but not vice versa, but even that would obviously be the wrong way around for my needs.

Your bro's laptop isn't completely useless anyways, can use it with Linux and an external drive. Makes for a basic enough desktop for doing whatever!
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Yeah, I actually tested that. It does work, but then I personally don't need it for anything and don't really use Linux these days, and no one else in my family really has use for it either... so don't know what'll come of it. Too bad the connector plastic broke to begin with though, such a small "flaw" restricting the comp's usefulness so much!
 
What model is that? Might be able to get a replacement connector for it.
 
HP 6735b. Basically the plastic part of the connector came loose from the metal "strips" and won't go back in place properly anymore.
 
ZYFER said:
Maybe this is what you are looking for?

http://cgi.ebay.com/HP-Compaq-6735S...768?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415bcfb360

Also saw a listing that is selling a HDD caddy that seems to replace the optical drive with a 2nd hard drive.
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Ahh, that could indeed work! The part that broke off is the big black plastic part on the left which connects to the HDD itself, but as the image also demonstrates you have to replace the whole PCB part.

Although "interestingly" a possible fix presents me with a slight dilemma, since I moved the HDD to other uses just a few days ago (as a HDD of a desktop system)... despite formatting the C: drive it does still have the restore partitions though, so I guess I should be able to restore the system still. But I'd need a new HDD for that other computer :eek:

Biggest problem is that shipping of that part to Finland costs $29,25 which is a bit unreasonable given its small size :( It seems some European sellers list the part too, so gotta see if I can one that ships for a nice price.

EDIT: On a closer look of both the auctions as well as the innards of the HP 6735b, those optical "converters" and the supposed actual HDD SATA connector board seem to be the same thing with the same part number. As such both are a replacement for the optical drive rather than for the connector which is broken and seems to be attached to the main motherboard. Obviously this still would be an option even as such, but a less optimal one.
 
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Probably a better option than letting the thing sit and do nothing though! Didn't realize you were in Finland, shipping is free to me. I suppose the option is maybe reattach it with glue or solder depending on the break point.
 
ZYFER said:
I suppose the option is maybe reattach it with glue or solder depending on the break point.
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It doesn't seem to fit snugly into place no matter what I do. Also the major problem is getting the "metal strips" that actually do the data transfer to go properly into place inside the plastic part... no matter how I tried, I couldn't manage that :( Had the same problem once when the end came loose off a HDMI cable, couldn't get it to go properly back together again.

Kinda sucks that it broke, it happened when my brother was disassembling the thing when it had some problems starting up. Now it starts up alright, but obviously worse for the wear... hehe.
 
tvih said:
I checked the fan as well, and cleaned it and all that, but it made no difference. Even blasted it with an external tabletop fan which lowered the temps but did nothing for the speed at which the computer functions.
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Did you also clean the heatsink? You may have blown all of the dust bunnies from the fan deeper into the heatsink or the intake ports.

You should consider taking a vacuum to intake and exhaust ports. If that doesn't work, open it up, take out the heatsink and clean it, and apply new thermal paste.
 
Anyone else get the feeling that CBD never even bothered to read the entire topic?

tvih said:
It doesn't seem to fit snugly into place no matter what I do. Also the major problem is getting the "metal strips" that actually do the data transfer to go properly into place inside the plastic part... no matter how I tried, I couldn't manage that :( Had the same problem once when the end came loose off a HDMI cable, couldn't get it to go properly back together again.

Kinda sucks that it broke, it happened when my brother was disassembling the thing when it had some problems starting up. Now it starts up alright, but obviously worse for the wear... hehe.
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Well, using the 2nd Bay might be the only option of getting it going again. Only other choice is probably more than you'd want to spend, and that would be a new motherboard. Hard to really suggest better options on that thing without seeing exactly where the issue lies.

As for the other laptop, I still think we are looking at a CPU or motherboard issue. I can't see anything else being the problem. Even if it doesn't look it, the CPU could have been damaged from overheating at some point. The chance of it being the motherboard is probably higher though due to the general complexity of the design. The system just might be stuck in throttle mode for the most part. Without parts to swap it out with, can't really know for sure.

Apply a little thermal material and get it back together and see if the results are any better. About as much as you can do at the moment. It is a real shame laptops don't follow more of a standard, would make swapping out parts a much more enjoyable experience.
 
can you rig it up with a desktop heatsink and fan for testing purposes or maybe toss a cold pack on it dry ice perhaps... just something to make the cpu stay cold for a longer period of time something i did when i diagnosed my cousins laptop her laptop kept bsoding and i was able to temporarily stop that by putting a cold pack underneath it so i ordered a new heat sink assembly and installed it and the laptop was fixed then the hard drive died on her but that could have been caused by the overheating.
 
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Well, reassembled the computer, same temps as before it seems. Bleh. Further tests will have to wait until Sunday or Monday, since need to check with my mother if there's any files she still needs from the computer before I reinstall Windows once again (something messed up with it right now).
 
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