NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTEo5NfXMX8

Can someone confirm that the fan motor is making this noise when my fans are on? To me, it looks like motor noise since it disappears the second I turn the power to the fans off (0:34), before the fan stops spinning (thus probably ruling out vibration?). Apologies for the poor recording, but it is still obvious which noise I'm talking about.
The fans ramp up to 1000 RPM when on, the lowest setting ASUS AI Suite allows with these fans. These fans are easily the loudest part right now, even at 1000 RPM, so I'm considering replacing them.

EDIT: OK, yeah, I just put the two fans on separate fan headers and one has a sound like there's gravel in it while the other is pretty good.


Malangyar said:
Nice build. So the consensus is to have the PSU mounted so that it pulls air from inside the case? Also, do the grills that come with the case have a purpose or just for show? :)
Click to expand...

My reasoning was that the air from the CPU cooler would help create airflow inside the PSU while the fan is off, but I personally can't keep the temperature low enough that the PSU fan stays off (props to SilverStone though, the fan is very quiet at idle). I'd reverse it so it pulls air from the outside.
 
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XelNika said:
Apologies for the poor recording, but it is still obvious which noise I'm talking about.
Click to expand...

All sounded really loud, until I set the sound level according to your mouseclicks! I hear less noise after 0:34 but still hard to tell. Pretty sure with "motor noise" you mean bearing noise?

Which model of fans are those exactly?
 
WiSK said:
All sounded really loud, until I set the sound level according to your mouseclicks! I hear less noise after 0:34 but still hard to tell. Pretty sure with "motor noise" you mean bearing noise?

Which model of fans are those exactly?
Click to expand...

Corsair SP120 HP. They're obviously not low noise fans, but there's a clear difference in the quality of the noise between the two.

I could definitely use some low speed fans. Not sure if I should go for the SP120 Q, considering that one of my current SP120s sounds bad and SPCR complained about bearing noise and vibration issues. I do know that even while running a stress test, my temps don't pass 85 C with my fans at 1300 RPM so the 1450 RPM SP120 would be sufficient for any gaming scenario and quieter at idle.
 
This won't fit the Ncase @ 63.5 mm... but wow: Aqua Computer Airplex modularity system 240 mm
1ZeLYBZ.png


EDIT: Apparently the newly revealed Airplex Radical 2 might be a better fit for our cases. @ L 280/284 x W 140 x H 40mm. Though we'll have to wait for the 240 models to be revealed.
AC%20360%20rad%202.jpg
 
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What is the best possible way to securely mount ddc pump at the bottom front case? Now i have the pump free standing and that cause slight vibration and noise even with the weight from phobya top.
 
ruffstuff said:
What is the best possible way to securely mount ddc pump at the bottom front case? Now i have the pump free standing and that cause slight vibration and noise even with the weight from phobya top.
Click to expand...
I believe some people have used a Shoggy Sandwich but they had to take out the foam part in between.
Perhaps a layer of Sorbothane with double sided tape?
 
I bought a thermal pad off ebay and used a cheap aluminum IC heatsink w/ a hole drilled through it to mount it to the bottom of the case:

Pump
Thermal Pad
Case floor
Aluminum heatsink

My pump is MCP35X so it has hole in the bottom already for the swiftech heatsink kit to cool it down
Will try to add pic later
 
Can anyone tell me the clearance between the bottom of a GTX card with full EK waterblock and bottom of the case?
 
aaronator said:
Can anyone tell me the clearance between the bottom of a GTX card with full EK waterblock and bottom of the case?
Click to expand...

Around 1.8" with my ek thermosphere, not sure if that helps any. Also not much clearance at all, mcp35x with alphacool is less than 5mm clearance

These pictures answer the previous question and maybe you can judge exactly how much space is available (hint: almost none)

NYtGjWhl.jpg

svbObiml.jpg

921NvE0l.jpg


Thermal pad doubles as the vibration dampening material..
 
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aaronator said:
Can anyone tell me the clearance between the bottom of a GTX card with full EK waterblock and bottom of the case?
Click to expand...

Just measured it, 46-48mm clearance between the bottom of my ekwb gtx 670 waterblock and the bottom of the case.
 
Malangyar said:
Nice build. So the consensus is to have the PSU mounted so that it pulls air from inside the case? Also, do the grills that come with the case have a purpose or just for show? :)
Click to expand...

Woops, no sorry.. I completely missed what direction I wanted to have the PSU in. Of course I want the fan to face the back of the case all alone.

Fixed that now! :D
XFS75qy.jpg

RpB3xvY.jpg
 
Kosire said:
Woops, no sorry.. I completely missed what direction I wanted to have the PSU in. Of course I want the fan to face the back of the case all alone.

Fixed that now! :D
Click to expand...

Kosire, is there either an objective (temperature/performance) or subjective (noise) improvement/degradation when you orient the power supply that way? Just curious :)
 
PlayfulPhoenix said:
Kosire, is there either an objective (temperature/performance) or subjective (noise) improvement/degradation when you orient the power supply that way? Just curious :)
Click to expand...
There are potentially quite a few factors to take into consideration:

Fan pulling from outside the case -
+ Pulls cool outside air straight in
+ Minimal obstruction to airflow for PSU fan
+/- Fan noise directed from right side of case
- Relies on internal 80x15mm PSU fan to draw air
- Restricts airflow through second 120mm side inlet

Fan pulling from inside the case-
+ Can direct cool air to PSU with 120mm fan, potentially reducing PSU internal fan speed
+ Fan noise muffled by case internals
+/- Fan noise directed from left side of case
- If 240mm radiator installed, hot air will be fed to PSU
- If no ventilation fan installed, will pull warm air from case internals (heated by motherboard, potentially CPU HSF, potentially non-blower GPU HSF)
 
EdZ said:
There are potentially quite a few factors to take into consideration...
Click to expand...

Oh, absolutely - I ask because not many people have tried orienting it both ways. I'll take what information I can get ;)

The way I see it, though: if flipping it (so as to have the PSU pull air from the right side of the case) doesn't improve anything in that configuration -- or makes noise/temperature worse -- probably no-one with air-cooling should do it. Especially since that's a build with a fairly hot card with an open cooler, and the hungriest Intel CPU you can put in there.

If you have a radiator, that's different, but assuming the same CPU/GPU, it might not be that different. That would really need to be tried and tested, though. Intuition tells me you'd want to flip the power supply, but intuition can be wrong.
 
PlayfulPhoenix said:
Oh, absolutely - I ask because not many people have tried orienting it both ways. I'll take what information I can get ;)

The way I see it, though: if flipping it (so as to have the PSU pull air from the right side of the case) doesn't improve anything in that configuration -- or makes noise/temperature worse -- probably no-one with air-cooling should do it. Especially since that's a build with a fairly hot card with an open cooler, and the hungriest Intel CPU you can put in there.

If you have a radiator, that's different, but assuming the same CPU/GPU, it might not be that different. That would really need to be tried and tested, though. Intuition tells me you'd want to flip the power supply, but intuition can be wrong.
Click to expand...

No difference yet.. except I can hear the PSU fan more since it's facing towards me now instead of facing the opposite direction and hiding inside the case.

But logicially it should be better.

I'm gonna try and rotate the CPU fan too, to see if there is any difference on CPU temps.
 
JaccoW said:
I believe some people have used a Shoggy Sandwich but they had to take out the foam part in between.
Perhaps a layer of Sorbothane with double sided tape?
Click to expand...
Will try with double sided tape.

Siba said:
Around 1.8" with my ek thermosphere, not sure if that helps any. Also not much clearance at all, mcp35x with alphacool is less than 5mm clearance

These pictures answer the previous question and maybe you can judge exactly how much space is available (hint: almost none)

NYtGjWhl.jpg



Thermal pad doubles as the vibration dampening material..
Click to expand...
That is not a pretty sight at the bottom. Is the heatsink really doing its job? How is the contact between the pump base and the heatsink?
 
ruffstuff said:
Will try with double sided tape.


That is not a pretty sight at the bottom. Is the heatsink really doing its job? How is the contact between the pump base and the heatsink?
Click to expand...

I didn't have access to a machine shop, so that's basically what I could do with WD40 and a hand drill with a rotary tool to debur it a bit. You definitely can't see the heatsink unless you pick the whole case up so I'm not exactly hurting on the aesthetics side of things. Cheap and dirty solution I guess?

The heatsink comes into flush contact with the base of the case, and stays very close to the temp of the pump. Doesn't take much to stabilize the temps when I'm only running the pump at 40-60%. The base of the pump is also flush with the bottom of the case and can be adjusted because only one screw is used, and that location has tons of ventilation area to stick the screw through.
 
How feasible is doing something like this using the EK-SBAY DDC pump/res?
68MUSBV.png


The right side would be for filling the unit, but once reseated would be far enough back when installed so that theres still access to USB/audio jacks.

I'm not sure what the inlet for the unit would be hooked up to though, because of limited vertical space under the GPU.
 
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aaronator said:
How feasible is doing something like this using the EK-SBAY DDC pump/res?
68MUSBV.png


The right side would be for filling the unit, but would be far enough back when installed so that theres still access to USB/audio jacks.

I'm not sure what the inlet for the unit would be hooked up to though, because of limited vertical space under the GPU.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure but I am interested in an answer to this question.
 
EdZ said:
There are potentially quite a few factors to take into consideration:

Fan pulling from outside the case -
+ Pulls cool outside air straight in
+ Minimal obstruction to airflow for PSU fan
+/- Fan noise directed from right side of case
- Relies on internal 80x15mm PSU fan to draw air
- Restricts airflow through second 120mm side inlet
Click to expand...

Another minus is that you have to mount yet another dust filter. If the PSU pulls air from within the case then you only need dust filters on one side (+ bottom). But if it pulls air from the other side then you need dust filters on both sides.

I think I'll have mine pulling air from inside the case...I guess it will somewhat reduce the positive pressure but I guess not by much.

It would be nice if we could get some actual temps with different orientation of the PSU. Right now we're just speculating. ;)
 
aaronator said:
Sorry lol. I'm not sure how to route tubing down to the bay so that it's also partially removable (like in the picture) for access to the fillports.
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I've thought about it and don't see how you can remove the bay res if the GPU is installed. You'll have to ask Printermeow how he filled his.
 
This may seem like a dumb question but I have the EVGA slot load drive and can't physically press the eject button from the outside with all the panels on. Am I just supposed to use the operating system to eject every time?
 
Yes, you'll have to use the eject command in your OS. I have the EVGA slot load drive too in my Hadron. The drive doesn't even have a face plate and the M1 doesn't have an eject button on its panel.
 
Have you experienced this in games and if so, haven't your GPU temperatures increased because of this ?
Because I would suspect that the temperature difference is because of the warmer air that your GPU is leaving in your case.
 
Phuncz said:
Have you experienced this in games and if so, haven't your GPU temperatures increased because of this ?
Because I would suspect that the temperature difference is because of the warmer air that your GPU is leaving in your case.
Click to expand...

No. GPU temps are the same. (35C idle, 60-70C load)
CPU temps both idle and load fell about 10C. From 45~ to 35~ and in games from 70-80~ to 50-60~ depending on the game (how much CPU they need).

The way the fan is now is also the "correct" way that Noctua suggets. I just had to try the other way :D
 
aaronator said:
How feasible is doing something like this using the EK-SBAY DDC pump/res?
68MUSBV.png


The right side would be for filling the unit, but once reseated would be far enough back when installed so that theres still access to USB/audio jacks.

I'm not sure what the inlet for the unit would be hooked up to though, because of limited vertical space under the GPU.
Click to expand...

Currently I have mine setup practically that way, but without a GPU block, so instead of going to the gpu block, it goes between the gpu and radiator to the cpu inlet. With a 2 slot gpu cooler, the ek-sbay will not fit at all, but with a single slot waterblock, I believe it would. Now I don't know the answer of if the pump/res will be able to fit in AFTER the gpu is in place though.

https://imgur.com/a/cck52
 
So I got my W/C loop up & running for a few now

The pump, MCP35x is currently with the RMA dept as there was an issue that the pump would shut off if I plugged in the molex + 4pin pwm

I noticed that on my Apogee Drive II, the base has lots of black blotches and it doesn't come off with rubbing alcohol. Would it effect my temps?

Some shots



 
sashi said:
I noticed that on my Apogee Drive II, the base has lots of black blotches and it doesn't come off with rubbing alcohol. Would it effect my temps?
Click to expand...

That's just tarnish (copper oxide). It won't affect temperatures at all.

Best way to make it all shiny again is Brasso, but diluted spirit vinegar will work as well.

Funny thing: traditionally in watercooling forums, people recommend ketchup and a toothbrush for cleaning copper blocks. A little unusual, but it does work as the ketchup contains the vinegar and the toothbrush is made of nylon so doesn't scratch :D
 
Hello there :) Just registered to ask pros a question. I'm selling my ps4 (cant stand 30fps) and planning to build a portable super computer with 970 gtx and i7 cpu. I'm planning to buy node 304 case first and when I'm able to get a hold of m1 I'll just swap cases therefore i'm looking for compatible parts.

1.From what I've read silverstone 450w psu will be no problem to handle the load of 970 gtx as well as cpu + 3.5inch HD and 2x 2.5 drives yes ?

2.Not sure about the cooling, i've watched so many videos and reviews and i'm torn between corsair h60 / h90 (dunno if they will fit in m1) and big nocua heatsink coolers. PC being quiet is most important to me and from what i've read 970 runs cooler overall so CPU cooling is where i'm stuck. Which ones do you prefer and would you recommend ?

Best regards :)
 
Welcome bydus!

450W will be plenty of power but you may consider the 600W or the upcoming 500W SFX-L. The 500W is not 100% confirmed if it'll fit in the M1 but it has a 120mm fan and Tony from Silverstone has said they fine-tuning it to be quieter than the 600W which is already quieter than the 450W.

For CPU cooling I'd go with the Noctua if you want a really quiet build. Depending on the ambient noise level where you live it may not matter but the pump will be louder than the fan at idle.
 
On the other hand, a closed-loop cooler is a lot easier to mount in a confined space, and has the advantage that the mass of the cooler is supported by the chassis rather than the motherboard PCB. If you intend to take your case on the go, this may be a valid consideration.
 
Sorry if im a bit off-topic with a video card question.

Been waiting for the Maxwell cards for my M1 and thought a 970 would do but im not so sure on the blower types offered, hence im leaning towards a 980 reference card.

Are all reference design 980 made by nVidia so that the only thing that differs is basicly the box it comes in or does the companies like EVGA, MSI, Palit, Gainward make their own cards and perhaps follow the reference specification but use parts of different quality?

So basicly what I wonder is, does it matter if I buy a Asus or get a cheaper EVGA GTX980 when both are reference models?
 
Reckie said:
Are all reference design 980 made by nVidia so that the only thing that differs is basicly the box it comes in or does the companies like EVGA, MSI, Palit, Gainward make their own cards and perhaps follow the reference specification but use parts of different quality?
Click to expand...

The two biggest differences between reference cards across manufacturers:

  1. Who assembled it.
  2. What warranty you get with it.
A reference card is just a card that has to conform to very specific and strict specifications, as set by the company that makes the actual GPU (in this case, nVidia). But even though the cards are all the same on paper, in reality they are manufactured by different companies that probably do things slightly differently. Maybe (if allowed) they use slightly different parts, but most of the time they just make them as they make any other video card, and ship it at or near MSRP, as it appears to the end consumer. So in terms of what you are physically getting, there's no meaningful difference, especially since the heatsink is totally identical.

So all you are really left with in terms of differences are the reliability of the vendor (how good is their manufacturing?), and what warranty they provide. Which is to say, I would get the cheapest one available that isn't from a questionable vendor.
 
Guys I have a problem! I did not think of this at the time but my plans may be messed up and I may have to go with a 2.5 inch ssd. Can you boot from a Samsung xp941 m2 ssd in an asus maximus VII Z97 board. I had my layout perfectly but if I can't boot from the m2 drive I will have to remove slim ODD and use 2.5" SSD there and external ODD and I'd rather not. Anyone have any experience with this?
 
sashi said:
So I got my W/C loop up & running for a few now

The pump, MCP35x is currently with the RMA dept as there was an issue that the pump would shut off if I plugged in the molex + 4pin pwm

I noticed that on my Apogee Drive II, the base has lots of black blotches and it doesn't come off with rubbing alcohol. Would it effect my temps?

Some shots



Click to expand...

Incase anyone wondered why some cooling devices use nickel plated copper, this is the reason why
 
laststop311 said:
Guys I have a problem! I did not think of this at the time but my plans may be messed up and I may have to go with a 2.5 inch ssd. Can you boot from a Samsung xp941 m2 ssd in an asus maximus VII Z97 board. I had my layout perfectly but if I can't boot from the m2 drive I will have to remove slim ODD and use 2.5" SSD there and external ODD and I'd rather not. Anyone have any experience with this?
Click to expand...

Yes, it was discussed recently in the M7I thread.
 
Many thanks for replies. I've decided to go for normal heatsink cooling solution, after much research i've decided to go for noctua nh-l12 or noctua nh-l9i. However i'm not sure if nh-l9i will able to be quiet and cool i7-4970 cpu - any comments on that ? Also pardon for being a noob but I wanted to know how the nh-l12 cooling works. I've seen reviews and temps but not sure how its able to cool down as its pushing air through the radiator and on top of the heatsink where cpu is. I know there is a second fan in there that does pulling on cpu as well, so how is it able to cool so well? From my understanding it would be best to do it in reverse (in m1 case) as it would get the hot air outside of the case and not warming up the motherboard. I pictured it on the attached picture. Can some1 explain it to me like im 5 ? :)

timjxTA.jpg
 
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