NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Geoffrey4283 said:
I pulled the list of names from the pre-May 23rd revision history version, and was able to line it up with the current data (no new rows), and restore it.
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Thanks! My info in the buyers tab seems to be correct, but I'm nearly certain I also inputted all my build info somewhere in that spreadsheet months ago, and it's now gone (think it was in "cooling solutions"). From what I remember, there was a lot more builds on that same page that are now missing.

Don't think I ever changed it from "parts ordered" to "assembled" and was going to do that now, so maybe some dipshit thought it wise to delete incomplete builds :(
 
Peter_364 said:
will there be a new spreadsheet for new builds or should we just add to that one?
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I've been wondering myself what the best way to do it would be. The charts and statistics and whatnot won't be very meaningful if they just have everything commingled, while the "what works" and "what doesn't work" tabs are more useful if they keep everything in one place (with an indication of whether its been confirmed for V1, V2, or both).

2 viable choices (that I can think of):
1. Append "V1" to the tab label for Buyers/Charts/Statistics/Buyer Pivot, and build new equivalents for V2
2. Keep Buyers centralized, but add a column to the Buyers tab to flag V1 vs V2, and then have separate Charts/Statistics/Buyer Pivot for V1 and V2 using FILTER() (harder, but doable, like the way we split US and Everywhere Else into separate bits for half the stats).
 
AFD said:
Thanks! My info in the buyers tab seems to be correct, but I'm nearly certain I also inputted all my build info somewhere in that spreadsheet months ago, and it's now gone (think it was in "cooling solutions"). From what I remember, there was a lot more builds on that same page that are now missing.

Don't think I ever changed it from "parts ordered" to "assembled" and was going to do that now, so maybe some dipshit thought it wise to delete incomplete builds :(
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I was going to go check the revision history, but I was staring at it for a bit, and realized that someone had just filtered for things that had been identified as assembled. You're still in there!

Damnable thing about GDocs is that when one person filters, it applies to everyone (which is awesome when you want it, and infernal when you don't).
 
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Geoffrey4283 said:
You're still in there!
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Awesome, thanks again! :)

Since the changes to M1 v2 are relatively minor, I think it would be really nice for v2 users to continue adding to the current spreadsheet, but with new columns added to differentiate between v1 and v2.
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
I was going to go check the revision history, but I was staring at it for a bit, and realized that someone had just filtered for things that had been identified as assembled. You're still in there!

Damnable thing about GDocs is that when one person filters, it applies to everyone (which is awesome when you want it, and infernal when you don't).
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Yeah, the problem is when someone filters and doesn't unfilter when he's done. Right after the pre-order came online, someone filtered for a single country and I thought someone had deleted everything until I noticed the filter.
 
Hi there. Can I get a somewhere the rest of the accessories for the M1? I'm looking of the screws for SSD. In the box was just 5 but its not enough for me. I saw on the website that are available just panels but I have not seen anywhere the rest of the accessories. If anyone knows where I can buy the screws I will be so glad. I think it should be available on the manufacturer's website. Thanks and best regards.
 
irek83 said:
Hi there. Can I get a somewhere the rest of the accessories for the M1? I'm looking of the screws for SSD. In the box was just 5 but its not enough for me. I saw on the website that are available just panels but I have not seen anywhere the rest of the accessories. If anyone knows where I can buy the screws I will be so glad. I think it should be available on the manufacturer's website. Thanks and best regards.
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Just buy a similar M3 screw, it doesn't have to be the exact same model. Get a regular non-shoulder M3 screw if that's easier and ignore the soft mounting (which isn't necessary on an SSD anyway).You can probably get this at a local hardware store or something if you can't find it online and can't import. I don't know the measurements of the included shoulder screws, but it shouldn't be difficult if those are what you want.

EDIT: The more I read your post, the less sure I am which screw you want. Here are a few examples of screws that might fit:

http://www.accuscrews.co.uk/low-head-cap-screws/8865-SSCL-M3-4-A4.html
http://www.accuscrews.co.uk/button-screws/8275-SSB-M3-4-A4.html
http://www.accuscrews.co.uk/flanged-button-screws/8594-SSBF-M3-8-A2.html
http://www.accuscrews.co.uk/countersunk-socket-head-screws/5595-SSK-M3-6-A4.html

My point is that it makes more sense to simply buy these directly than pay an inflated price to have Necere stock them.
 
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Necere, is it possible to buy a panel kit without the ODD slot? Or do you have to buy a full panel kit (with slot), and then also order the top panel (without the ODD slot) separately?
 
has anyone worked out if its viable to fit 2x H80i's in here for both CPU + GPU? i figure that the biggest obstacle will be routing the loop from above to below the GPU.

just out of interest as i already have one h80i and have been looking into putting the quiets onto my GTX770.
 
irek83 said:
Hi there. Can I get a somewhere the rest of the accessories for the M1? I'm looking of the screws for SSD. In the box was just 5 but its not enough for me. I saw on the website that are available just panels but I have not seen anywhere the rest of the accessories. If anyone knows where I can buy the screws I will be so glad. I think it should be available on the manufacturer's website. Thanks and best regards.
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XelNika said:
My point is that it makes more sense to simply buy these directly than pay an inflated price to have Necere stock them.
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PlayfulPhoenix said:
Necere, is it possible to buy a panel kit without the ODD slot? Or do you have to buy a full panel kit (with slot), and then also order the top panel (without the ODD slot) separately?
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Managing inventory and orders is w360's job, and because of that it's mostly his call which parts to offer or not.

As far as the 2.5" mounting screws, w360 did order a bunch of extra. Go ahead and send him an email if you'd like to order some.

callumbolch said:
has anyone worked out if its viable to fit 2x H80i's in here for both CPU + GPU? i figure that the biggest obstacle will be routing the loop from above to below the GPU.
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An H80i is very unlikely to fit on the forward side bracket position. You'd have a better chance with a thinner rad.
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
I pulled the list of names from the pre-May 23rd revision history version, and was able to line it up with the current data (no new rows), and restore it. Then I fixed the Statistics queries (which fixed the Charts), and scrapped and re-built the Buyer Pivot, because it was angry, and refused to be resuscitated. I know my row is right, and celebrities like ANML, M4rk, and The_Cheese are correct, so I have at least some confidence that I managed not to just further hose it.

It honestly doesn't look like there have been any legitimate changes to the Buyers sheet since May (one guy added an updated link to his buildlog; one person in the US had their country overwritten by "fin"), but I was afraid a full restore might lose a lot more of the content in the other tabs that would be harder to spot.
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Awesome.

As to how we deal with the future data. Could move the buyers tab to a later page, and bring a new tab to the front, so V2 users will default to the new forward page, and it will keep the V1 data intact, separate, and keep it accessible.
 
Necere said:
Silverstone has announced two different upcoming SFX PSUs:

  1. SST-SX600-G: 600W modular gold-rated, standard SFX size (100mm long), OEM is Enhance
  2. SST-SX500-GL: 500W modular gold-rated, "SFX-L" (130mm long), OEM is High Power

There are pics linked in this post (note the 600W is probably a ST45SF-G with a sticker).
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Would the SFX-L fit, with a long graphics card? 140mm non-modular is the limit for ATX psu as I recall, but what about 130mm modular? I suspect 10mm extra space isn't enough, but I hope I'm wrong.

Photos from sweclockers.com:

Silverstone_sfx-8.jpg


Silverstone_sfx-9.jpg
 
backfeed said:
Would the SFX-L fit, with a long graphics card?
Photos from sweclockers.com:
Silverstone_sfx-8.jpg
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Oh no ... looking at that picture I wonder if the 500 Watt version even would fit in the M1 with fan facing outside (hint power connector) :confused:
 
Didn't someone say that there would be different orientation power cables available?
Necere said:
We've talked about the possibility of offering parts for sale through the site, including screws and cables. We might be able to get a left-angle version of the power cable for those people who were unable to use the included cable with certain ATX PSUs
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backfeed said:
Would the SFX-L fit, with a long graphics card?
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Necere answered this some months ago, or even last year when we saw the HighPower version. I can't find the post(s) now, but I believe the answer was: we don't know yet.

Edit: Found it !
Necere said:
It's one of those "it's gonna be tight" things. A 130mm long PSU has about 20mm between itself and the top of a long GPU, which isn't a lot for modular cables. It may help that the SFX is off to the side, so the cables have some place to go next to the GPU. How readily it fits we won't really know until someone actually tests it.
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Peter_364 said:
Didn't someone say that there would be different orientation power cables available?
off to search for the post
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Yes, Necere said they might be able to order a limited number alternate facing power plugs.
 
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I know I've posted this picture too many times, but with a gentle warming of the power cable, over a few minutes with a flame torch, you can get the cable to comfortably bend around, and stay in that approximate position. Would advise against doing this cold for risk of stressing/fracturing the insulation.

With the cable looped back in my photo, it would appear that with the existing cable, you should be able to get it to bend within the width of the 500W L PSU.
 
WiSK said:
Necere answered this some months ago, or even last year when we saw the HighPower version. I can't find the post(s) now, but I believe the answer was: we don't know yet.
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Ok, thanks. Haven't been reading this thread for a long time and didn't find anything when searching, but I guess I suck at searching. :)

I'll simply buy the SFX-L when it becomes available, and see if I can get it to fit.
 
okwchin said:
I know I've posted this picture too many times, but with a gentle warming of the power cable, over a few minutes with a flame torch, you can get the cable to comfortably bend around, and stay in that approximate position. Would advise against doing this cold for risk of stressing/fracturing the insulation.

With the cable looped back in my photo, it would appear that with the existing cable, you should be able to get it to bend within the width of the 500W L PSU.
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Very interesting indeed. Should work! I don't have a flame torch, but I'm guessing my heat gun should work as well.
 
The good think about the 500W and also the 600W PSU is, that both are coming with that Silverstone flat cable set.
 
Aibohphobia said:
Was looking at the SweClockers tour of Lian-Li's factory and look what I spotted chilling out on a desk there: http://www.sweclockers.com/image/red/2014/06/05/Lianli_fabrik-44.jpg?t=original&k=44178b93

Looks like a V2 prototype :D
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That's cool :)

On the office floor intermingled administrative staff with chassis engineers who files for future products. All around the desk stands a myriad of prototypes, with everything from the chassis as it never became something of, to the Kickstarter-funded mini chassis Ncase M1.
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I'm probably missing something, but was there some post somewhere that explained all the different shipping options (in my case to a US residential destination)?
 
Necere said:
Managing inventory and orders is w360's job, and because of that it's mostly his call which parts to offer or not.
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Is there a deadline to order the extra panels or is it the same as the M1 (June 22, 2014)? I want to wait a little bit and see if no-ODD white panel set becomes available.
 
caycep said:
I'm probably missing something, but was there some post somewhere that explained all the different shipping options (in my case to a US residential destination)?
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It might have been mentioned, and there's a link to Taiwan Postal Services. Here's my understanding of it.

TW Air $74: direct from factory, shipped by air; 10-14 days
TW Surface Airlift $49: direct from factory, low priority air shipping; 21-22 days
TW Surface $34: direct from factory, then very slowly across the ocean; 75-90 days
US Economy $20: guessing it goes first to Wahaha360, who then forwards it on; 6-8 weeks

Looking at this, doesn't make much sense to do TW Surface if you are in the US, although for me in The Netherlands, TW Surface has a more attractive price. Still I chose air because I'm impatient :)
 
JaccoW said:
Are there any examples of people using these cases with an external Pump/res combo?
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There is a pic in the user build gallery of an EK tube res on the back. This could probably be combined witha dcc or d5 pump, but it would leave you with limited access to the ports on your GPU since the pump would cover about half the back of the card. The inlet/outlet ports on the pump top would need to line up with the holes on the back of the case though.

It's an intresting thought though. If you already have a res back there, a pump on the bottom wouldn't limit you as long as you (from most gpu layouts) stick to dvi ports for your screen. This might be worth lookig into.
 
Urelure said:
There is a pic in the user build gallery of an EK tube res on the back. This could probably be combined witha dcc or d5 pump, but it would leave you with limited access to the ports on your GPU since the pump would cover about half the back of the card. The inlet/outlet ports on the pump top would need to line up with the holes on the back of the case though.

It's an intresting thought though. If you already have a res back there, a pump on the bottom wouldn't limit you as long as you (from most gpu layouts) stick to dvi ports for your screen. This might be worth lookig into.
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Well it's either that or having the res stick out above the case (not that pretty) or having the pump stick out towards the back.

Or designing your own custom res...

I have done some rough modelling in Google Sketchup and with a dual rad there simply isn't enough space for an internal pump as well. It would block the cables of the modular PSU. But there are plenty of mounting option on the back and it doesn't really mattter if it sticks out a bit... think a flat res on the 92mm fan mounting point and the pump mounted straight to the back of it, providing a direct inlet from the res to the pump and the pump blowing straight down and through a tube or angled connector into the case.
It would stick out 10cm or so but it might work.

I'm going to show you a mockup when I get home after this weekend.
Could anyone provide me with a shot of the rear of their case? Preferably someone who does not have a fan or FrozenQ reservoir mounted to it. All I found so far was a good shot from this post but that is the prototype with some extra options.
 
WiSK said:
Looking at this, doesn't make much sense to do TW Surface if you are in the US, although for me in The Netherlands, TW Surface has a more attractive price. Still I chose air because I'm impatient :)
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Lol, in Denmark my choices were US Economy ($51) and TW Air ($59) so it was an easy decision.
 
WiSK said:
It might have been mentioned, and there's a link to Taiwan Postal Services. Here's my understanding of it.

TW Air $74: direct from factory, shipped by air; 10-14 days
TW Surface Airlift $49: direct from factory, low priority air shipping; 21-22 days
TW Surface $34: direct from factory, then very slowly across the ocean; 75-90 days
US Economy $20: guessing it goes first to Wahaha360, who then forwards it on; 6-8 weeks

Looking at this, doesn't make much sense to do TW Surface if you are in the US, although for me in The Netherlands, TW Surface has a more attractive price. Still I chose air because I'm impatient :)
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Hm, well Surface Airlift is almost as good as Air, though...
 
So here's one of the rest reviews of the 4790K that i've seen (and am waiting for myself)

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Proces...view-and-Overclocking/Overclocking-Experience

while pcper isn't exactly my go to place for benchmarks, and I wouldn't make my conclusions until we see a bigger sample size, it seems the biggest difference between the 4790k and the 4770k is the TIM intel used.

again, i'll wait and see, but since I'm pretty curious about deliding, I might end up picking up a cheap 4770k chip instead if I can find one for cheap
 
JaccoW said:
Well it's either that or having the res stick out above the case (not that pretty) or having the pump stick out towards the back.

Or designing your own custom res...

I have done some rough modelling in Google Sketchup and with a dual rad there simply isn't enough space for an internal pump as well. It would block the cables of the modular PSU. But there are plenty of mounting option on the back and it doesn't really mattter if it sticks out a bit... think a flat res on the 92mm fan mounting point and the pump mounted straight to the back of it, providing a direct inlet from the res to the pump and the pump blowing straight down and through a tube or angled connector into the case.
It would stick out 10cm or so but it might work.

I'm going to show you a mockup when I get home after this weekend.
Could anyone provide me with a shot of the rear of their case? Preferably someone who does not have a fan or FrozenQ reservoir mounted to it. All I found so far was a good shot from this post but that is the prototype with some extra options.
Click to expand...

I'm trying to consider having a nice acrylic tube res out the back as well... but since it'll be hanging there I figured something like this would be a pretty sweet deal to get:

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...ling_Kit_w_D5_Photon_and_Free_Dead-Water.html

the mounting brace on the res need to be 150mm apart though :(
 
milkcow said:
:D :D :D
temps?
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PlayfulPhoenix said:
Gandergray, did you get around to any testing? How has your build turned out? Any thoughts regarding the bottom-mounted radiator, after some use?
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For additional information, particularly component information, see related Posts 10191, 10224, 11361 and 11378.

Furmark Burn-in Benchmark (Resolution: 1920 x 1080) (Correction: 1920 x 1200)
Ambient Temperature: 23ºC
Fans—Highest RPM: 1305, 1317, 1305 (Maximum Specified RPM: 1300)
Pump—Highest RPM: 4128 (Maximum Specified RPM: 4500)
GPU—Highest Temperature: 61ºC
CPU—Highest Temperature by Core: 76ºC, 72ºC, 71ºC, 64ºC

Heaven Benchmark 4.0 (Resolution: 1920 x 1080) (Correction: 1920 x 1200)
Ambient Temperature: 25ºC
Fans—Highest RPM: 1309, 1319, 1317
Pump—Highest RPM: 3276
GPU—Highest Temperature: 56ºC
CPU—Highest Temperature by Core: 72ºC, 67ºC, 64ºC, 72ºC

Prime95 Version 28 with Heaven Benchmark 4.0 (Resolution: 1920 x 1080) (Correction: 1920 x 1200)
--> ABORTED AFTER 12 MINUTES <--
Ambient Temperature: 26ºC
Fans&#8212;Highest RPM: 1304, 1310, 1388
Pump&#8212;Highest RPM: 4530
GPU&#8212;Highest Temperature: 54ºC
CPU&#8212;Highest Temperature by Core: 91ºC, 91ºC, 91ºC, 91ºC


Not surprisingly, this combination of radiators and fans, i.e., the upper side panel mounted 120 radiator and bottom mounted 240 radiator, both with thinner fin density and slim fans, and the restricted air flow for the bottom mounted 240 radiator, does not have the cooling prowess of an upper side panel mounted 240 radiator with higher fin density and 25mm fans. Nonetheless, this configuration seems to be able to competently handle gaming and other GPU intensive tasks.

The results of the Heaven test are fairly representative of the higher temperatures that I observe while gaming.

The GPU water block seems to perform well. But, I&#8217;d like better cooling for the CPU, and thus, I&#8217;m considering direct mounting of the CPU cooler to the CPU die. See for example, the quality work performed by Idontcare: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595 . Even if I don&#8217;t mount the CPU cooler directly to the CPU die, once I obtain one of the Silverstone 600 watt SFX power supplies, I&#8217;ll probably install a 240 radiator with higher fin density and 25mm fans on the upper side panel&#8212;as contemplated by others in this thread.

In order to improve airflow around the bottom mounted 240 radiator, I considered taller feet, but decided against them. I may, however, create short pedestals for the feet.

I think the bottom mounted 240 radiator is a viable option for supplemental cooling.


Additional photographs follow:

crqm.jpg




v783.jpg




lakv.jpg




vn23.jpg




5dyi.jpg
 
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Gandergray said:
For additional information, particularly component information, see related Posts 10224, 11361 and 11378.
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Could you link to those posts, please ? I don't think there is an easy way to find them.

Gandergray said:
Not surprisingly, this combination of radiators and fans, i.e., the upper side panel mounted 120 radiator and bottom mounted 240 radiator, both with thinner fin density and slim fans, and the restricted air flow for the bottom mounted 240 radiator, does not have the cooling prowess of an upper side panel mounted 240 radiator with higher fin density and 25mm fans. Nonetheless, this configuration seems to be able to competently handle gaming and other GPU intensive tasks.
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While it is viable, in the end it's still much less optimal, like I and others have been saying. While you are adding a larger buffer (more mass due to extra radiator), you are also lowering the capacity to remove the heat from them with slim fans and low fin-density rads.

In the end, you have made a working example that it is indeed possible, but you have also shown it isn't better than a single radiator. I am impressed by your build with two rads and an ATX PSU, that must have been madness to assemble.

Gandergray said:
In order to improve airflow around the bottom mounted 240 radiator, I considered taller feet, but decided against them. I may, however, create short pedestals for the feet.
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It wouldn't matter since the fans will have the hardest time pushing air up against the GPU. Even if you increase the supply of air, the air being expelled is still very limited. You would need higher static pressure fans, which isn't simple with slim fans.
 
Just writing to confirm, I got an acknowledgment from Paypal, but nothing else. Is that all I should expect for now?
 
macmodder said:
Just writing to confirm, I got an acknowledgment from Paypal, but nothing else. Is that all I should expect for now?
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It's been liek that for all of us so everything is fine:p

Just make sure your address on your paypal account is up to date. That's where they pull your shipping details.
 
Gandergray said:
...
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Thanks a bunch for your testing and reporting, Gandergrey! :D You've trailblazed the bottom-mounted radiator setup for the rest of us.

Just to confirm either way: Are your components at stock clocks? Don't recall you mentioning any overclocking but many WC for that purpose.
 
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