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Microsoft: Buy Office 365, Not Office 2013
- Thread starter CommanderFrank
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Agreed. Between open office and google docs I've completely given up on MS office products.
http://www.microsofthup.com/hupus/chooser.aspx?culture=en-US
Yup the Microsoft Home Use Program. Depending on the enterprise agreement your school or business has with Microsoft you may be entitled to Office 2013 PC or 2011 Mac for only $10.
SuperSubZero
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I tried Libre/OpenOffice for a semester of school and it was very rough. Despite having relatively simple Word documents, Lo/Oo liked to format things wrong, did not display certain things, and printouts did not look like they did on the screen. I had one particularly tricky situation where a worksheet was supposed to have small captioned drawings and my paper had a big blank space instead. I switched to Office 2013 mid-semester and all of those problems went away.
I think if you have absolute, 100% control of the documents you work with, Lo/Oo are fine. If you are being sent documents and you don't have control over how they were created, I'd approach with caution.
I think if you have absolute, 100% control of the documents you work with, Lo/Oo are fine. If you are being sent documents and you don't have control over how they were created, I'd approach with caution.
InorganicMatter
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All the FOSS guys clamoring about free alternatives lose with one simple word:
OneNote
Nothing (Evernote/Growl) even comes close.
OneNote
Nothing (Evernote/Growl) even comes close.
No one uses OneNote, I have used it but most people do not even know it exists. OneNote has very limited usage, Microsoft Word works fine for notes as well.
InorganicMatter
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Know how I know you haven't used OneNote?
A proper note taking suite consists of far more than simple text entry.
No one cares about people's personal opinions about Office (or MS), but for sure those opinions can include some useful info. So won't add much of my own. Other than to add that MS has been really eager to get people onto a "web subscription" for Office for some time now. Why? For them: more consistent & higher revenue due to the greatly increased costs for buyers over average years of usage vs. local Office versions before upgrading. For buyers: not much.
This "one copy per machine for life" rumor--whether its actually the case or not--is likely causing MS to jump for joy. People look at the options and their own usage, see that Office 365 is likely more flexible (thanks to the rumor), so looks like a better buy. Just what MS wants.
What people need to do is look at the current versions of LibreOffice (version 4.0 has just been released) (and/or OpenOffice) and see if it will fit in well with their anticipated usage. As stated, 90%+ of home users and a large number of business large and small can (and do) get by fine with them.
This "one copy per machine for life" rumor--whether its actually the case or not--is likely causing MS to jump for joy. People look at the options and their own usage, see that Office 365 is likely more flexible (thanks to the rumor), so looks like a better buy. Just what MS wants.
What people need to do is look at the current versions of LibreOffice (version 4.0 has just been released) (and/or OpenOffice) and see if it will fit in well with their anticipated usage. As stated, 90%+ of home users and a large number of business large and small can (and do) get by fine with them.
heatlesssun
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OneNote I think is now the 3rd most used program in the Office Suite behind Word and Excel but surpassing PowerPoint. And there's no way that Word is in any shape or fashion a replacement for OneNote. And limited usage? Like the ability to record audio and video and text and handwriting and search on all of it? Of the real-time synching of OneNote notebooks across the cloud or local networks or to work in an offline mode and have that data synch up automatically to as many devices as you like once connected to a network?
In some strange statistics, perhaps, but not in the real world. In nearly 15 years of IT experience, I've seen the name show up maybe 3 or 4 times. Word, Excel, Powerpoint, and Access remain the most-used apps I ever see anyone using.
You yourself are so arrogant that you assume every person in the world knows what you or I know. News flash: the vast majority of users know fuck-all about software alternatives. They don't research anything. They use at home what they used in college or use at work. If what you're claiming was even remotely true, then most businesses would be running on Linux, because it's free. They'd be using OpenOffice, because it's free. They'd be using Hotmail/Gmail/Yahoo mail, because it's free.
You either live in a bubble, are devastatingly deluded, or are lying about any experience with IT. Most businesses are still running on Windows XP, Office 2003, and Blackberry devices. Change is hard, so most businesses don't disrupt their productivity at great expense just to get everyone changed over to software suites that won't be the same that their vendors and clients use anyway. When they do change over, they carry out very small changes(like upping to Windows 7, not 8...oops you just burst a blood vessel) and they do it over many months. You seem to think that the interface drives production. No. Employees who are comfortable and familiar with their technical work environment drive production.
heatlesssun
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Where I work I see more and more people use it all of the time. It's the kind of app that when you learn about it realize what it can do, you wonder how you ever lived without. Of course there are other note taking apps out there but none are quite as powerful as OneNote that's I've looked at though some do have features that OneNote doesn't, like strong multi-platform support.
I never understood why Microsoft didn't push OneNote harder. They have put a lot of work into it, in fact it looks like they put the most effort into making OneNote 2013 the most touch friendly enabled app in the Office 2013 Suite.
Not even close. Microsoft's own SQM numbers put it at 7% usage, which has it significantly trailing everything else in Office except Publisher and Lync, and about on par with Access.
Oldie
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Additionally anyone who thinks CALC is a replacement for excel is just delusional. Office is a very well put together suite that doesn't yet have a functional rival.
heatlesssun
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If one could just install Linux and have everything work perfectly, all software and hardware function as it always did, then of course Linux on the desktop would rule. But it's not that simple and the benefit of the free attainment costs of Linux are completely negated and then some by many factors due to migration, testing, training and development costs.
I've been working in big business IT for 20 years now, I understand completely that change is difficult and slow particularly in large organizations. However, working for a big bank that's been face with upheaval like never before in the industry, we're dealing with a lot of rapid changes because there's no alternative.
We're a huge Microsoft customer and they gives us a lot of support and good pricing and we actually do a decent job of keeping up with current versions. Yes, we're on XP but that all changes this year as we being the real roll out of Windows 7 though individual users and groups have had the option to go to Windows 7 if they could. We got of Office 2003 years ago, with Office 2007 our baseline but again individual users and groups have the option of going to Office 2010 and even Office 2013 starting in the 3rd quarter I believe.
heatlesssun
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If you say so, I've read otherwise, just did a quick search and can't find much. But even just 7% of Office users world wide would be millions of users. In any case, whenever the subject of OneNote comes up there do seem to be a lot of people that swear by it, as several here have done already.
First it was that "obviously" anyone would take the free option over the pay option. Now you're adjusting it to say that the cumbersome changeover would warn them away. Well, congratulations. You just explained to yourself why your initial statement was wrong. "Free" means nothing if your operations come to a grinding halt for an upgrade. It's one of the reasons that Microsoft has worked so hard to make the transition process easier and easier, especially for enterprise-size companies.
So what you're saying is that you're still working on a 12-year-old operating system, and are just now rolling out a 4-year-old operating system, to use with a just-updated-to-6-year-old productivity suite. Which is the same as pretty much every company I visit on a regular basis. Again, you're making my point: the corporate world is constantly lagging because trying to be stringent in using new versions of software would cripple people's ability to do their work. In some cases, those upgrades are put off because of in-house software that hasn't been updated in a decade, and now they can't even make it work with 64-bit operating systems, yet somehow refuse to write a new package from scratch.
In general, businesses view IT as their lowest priority, in both paradigm and budget. Hence, even if free options exist to lower their costs, they don't have even five minutes to spare to hear how you can increase their profits. Companies are still run mostly by technologically incompetent MBA-holding nitwits who don't have any idea what they need...they just know that they want it fixed within one minute of it not working to their specific desires. There's no time to update them to better, more efficient systems, because they're always too busy. So employees continue to suffer under slow, ineffective infrastructure that breaks down twice a day, causing them to have to do constant overtime in order to meet basic deadlines...all because the supposedly most insightful people don't give a flying fuck about the goddamned equipment needed for their job, without which their entire livelihood would quickly collapse into dust.
Did I mention I'm looking for a new career?
Red Falcon
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To my knowledge, you appear to be the only one who ever even talks about OneNote or uses it, I haven't seen anyone else really even mention it.
And once again, you bring up your job.
Which, funny enough, you absolutely hate when others mention it, but it's totally ok if you do it.
Also, why would Microsoft make their applications have multi-platform support?
Well, that's what you get when one uses proprietary Microsoft software.
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OneNote is awesome, if used properly.
The internal SQM data shows that not only is it just 7% usage, but half its users would probably be fine with Word anyway (the SQM data tracks down to individual feature usage; e.g. only 4% of Excel users employ Pivot Tables). No need to take my word for it; the numbers aren't published but I'm sure if you're as big a Microsoft customer as you say your TAM can probably get you the summary/adoption data.
And sure, 7% of Office users is a large number ... but that's not nearly the same as your claim.
BS. Give people a choice between a 99 cent download and a link to a pirate version of the song that will cost them nothing. Guess which one they'll choose.
Sickb0y
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I don't know, but in totally unrelated news, ITunes is doing gangbusters.
heatlesssun
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I may have to check into this at work. I do know a lot of people what are using OneNote at work these days. I just don't see how Word is a replacement for OneNote, much of the power of OneNote lies in the notebook metaphor and easy search. One could do something similar with files and directories but that's not nearly as simple and elegant a solution as the notebook metaphor. Plus OneNote has fantastic synching capabilities. If you use more than one computer and want to keep notes on both and changes synched automatically it's hard to beat OneNote on that front.
I think something like OneNote is virtually a necessity for anyone that needs to keep track of freeform information, which is pretty much everyone. Anything I don't ever want to loose I put in OneNote, I've been doing that for ten years now and its just awesome to simply type a few keywords and instantly find stuff from years ago that I probably would have never found so easily otherwise.
Then please explain the "only 1 machine" thing.
If i purchase office 2013, install it, then change my motherboard (or buy a new computer) I should be able to re-install office 2013 because it still in use on 1 PC not 2.
If the case is that you can only install it on one machine and that's it, that is bull and most likely not legal.
Pretty much. The internal/codename for Office365 was Office PF. As in Pay Forever
The SQM data is global and far more telling than anything you'll find observing users in a single workplace. And I'm not saying that Word is a "replacement" for OneNote, merely pointing out that when you look at the feature usage breakdown, roughly half of its users don't use it properly at all and just type basic notes into it.
And yet somehow the vast majority of people manage just fine with paper and pen.
I've been a long term proponent of OneNote, sadly there's still not a really good platform for it. and I got tired of waiting. So, I've pretty much switched to a LiveScribe pen at this point. It works more fluidly, the battery lasts all week, and carrying it isn't a hassle.
bigdogchris
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Microsoft's primary source of revenue comes from it's business licensing department. So it's no coincidence that they want you to move to a subscription service, even for home products. Microsoft can shove it.
Microsoft spends a considerable amount of money on failed products, even going a decade before being profitable on their consoles (primarily due to shady backdoor deals and subscription services).
Microsoft spends a considerable amount of money on failed products, even going a decade before being profitable on their consoles (primarily due to shady backdoor deals and subscription services).
chockomonkey
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heatlesssun
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Not disagreeing with you here, just reporting what I've seen.
It's not such much a matter of using it properly but using it in the first place. Just start putting information into and the first time it saves one time and effort trying to track something important down it tends to get people hooked.
And how much time and effort to people spend trying to track down bits of paper, finding files or pictures with data all over the place?
I would agree, indeed Windows tablets have issues with portability and battery, this situation is getting better. Clover Trail Atoms are capable of running OneNote well and easily get more than a work day's battery life. Atoms coming out at the end of the year should get even a bit battery life with twice the performance.
brucedeluxe169
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I've been hating on everything that MS has been doing lately, but strangely don't mind the idea of Office 365. As I understand it, Office 365 give you access to the full fledged Office Suite through a web app, correct? So I, as an actuary (in training) I can do all my VBA programming and simulations on Excel running in IE, Firefox, or Chrome, on any computer hooked up to the internet? Then, save my results, code, session, etc and resume it all on a different computer at a different time? And this computer can be running any of Windows, Mac OS, Linux, iOS, Android, Windows Phone, etc?
And I can have this for $4 a month as an individual?
Seems like an awesome concept to me.... and one that, if MS executes correctly (are there any problems with my scenario above?) would give me faith that MS still has some excellent draws for the user, developer, and investor.
And I can have this for $4 a month as an individual?
Seems like an awesome concept to me.... and one that, if MS executes correctly (are there any problems with my scenario above?) would give me faith that MS still has some excellent draws for the user, developer, and investor.
For anyone organized/disciplined enough to use something like OneNote, perhaps surprisingly, not that much. Use a simple notebook and title/date your pages and its extremely easy and fast to find things.
Of course, search is still definitely more powerful. And having a back up and an easy way to share things via email (etc.) is very useful.
But then LiveScribe addresses those issues and does it cheaply, with all-week battery life. About the only thing it lacks is color. And all I have to carry is something the size of a premium pen and anything from a pocket book to a regular sized notepad. It's at least worth checking into if you like OneNote.
That would be nice; you'll excuse me for not holding my breath for anything labeled "Atom" right now though. Beyond that, even if they run OneNote perfectly, they're still going to have match the price, size, weight and battery life of the iPad/Nexus/Kindle for me to switch back.
Nope, not quite.
If you go with the business level subscriptions then the cheapest that gets you access to the Web-App versions of Office is $6/month (Plan P1). And they are a FAR cry from the full-fledged desktop versions in terms of functionality (forget VBA or doing anything that would resemble a simulation in Web-App Excel).
If you want the full power of Office you still need the desktop editions. These don't run via a browser and still require a full-blown Windows machine to operate. This starts at $20/month (Plan E3) for a single user (and is currently Office 2010).
As an individual user $99 a year gets you full-blown Office 2013 along with a variety of online capabilities and access to the less-functional Web-App versions (and expanded SkyDrive storage and 60 Skype Minutes/month). You can "install" Office 2013 on up to 5 machines simultaneously, but only one can be in use at a time (enforced).
Personally I don't think this is a particularly raw deal (though I'd still prefer to pay outright and not be tied to an online account). Office gets upgrade about once every 3 years, so you're looking at $300 - about what the full suite costs with legal discounts.
It'll be later this month/early next that the business versions of Office 365 get upgraded to Office 2013. Still going to be $20/month for that level of subscription though.
brucedeluxe169
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>.<
damn dude, you really crushed my Office in the cloud dream there..... For a second I thought MS was coming out with the biggest killer web app of all time
brucedeluxe169
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One last thing: I have a feeling that MS Office with complete functionality will come in web app form eventually, I just wonder how long it will take them to realize that its OK to provide such an awesome product to people who might not necessarily be running Windows.
That's already coming, actually. This spring in fact, bearing Microsoft hitting anymore roadblocks.
It's definitely a decision that MS didn't want to make and they forestalled it as long as possible. But, yea, the rise of cloud computing and BYOD has made the OS and platform a moot point for a whole lot of folks. If MS can allow their software to run on Android and iOS then it's a good thing, imo. It shows that they can't ignore a majority of the market anymore
Sure.
Right now they're still caught up in the Windows/Office cash-cow duopoly. Until realization dawns that Windows market share will inevitably be significantly eroded, they'll hold fast on a Windows requirement for the "full" office.
The first indication they're coming to terms with this reality will likely be the release of the iPad version of Office (all ready to go, but functionally similar to the Windows RT version). From there it's all downhill, as that will essentially kill Surface RT's USP.
Things are likely to evolve quite quickly from there. Improve the capabilities of browsers a bit, and let those standards proliferate some and then "real" Office on the web will be close behind.
brucedeluxe169
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That's already coming, actually. This spring in fact, bearing Microsoft hitting anymore roadblocks.
It's definitely a decision that MS didn't want to make and they forestalled it as long as possible. But, yea, the rise of cloud computing and BYOD has made the OS and platform a moot point for a whole lot of folks. If MS can allow their software to run on Android and iOS then it's a good thing, imo. It shows that they can't ignore a majority of the market anymore
Seems to me like MS's best strategy to grow their office business. A dirt cheap subscription for individuals ($20 per year per person?), and an expensive contract option for businesses (with extra business like features like collaboration, multiple editors, centralized management and document repos + version tracking) and all of a sudden, MS has made Apple's (piece of shit) office suite, and Google Docs irrelevant.
Make it work well on any standards complaint browser and don't make retarded decisions (like: make security priorities #1, #2, and #3, and reliability #4, #5, and #6) and MS will have a perpetual gold mine. Hell, MS can get creative (verified .edu email addresses get 4 years free! among other ideas) and draw in many new sources of revenue that they otherwise would have never had.
I don't know about goldmine, but yea, they stand to expand Office and potentially make more money from it.
Bear in mind that alternatives like OpenOffice and LibreOffice, and even Google Docs, have gained a following among those who used to rely on MS Office completely. In certain institutions like big business and enterprise, cloud-based subscription Office will certainly sell to the BYOD crowd. For the rest of the folks who don't need it or have already jumped ship... well... I'm not sure about that. The users are going to look the same, the difference here is that the subscription model will push these folks from a desktop/Windows only model to a "use your desktop and your iPad/Android/Windows tablet" model.
Bear in mind that alternatives like OpenOffice and LibreOffice, and even Google Docs, have gained a following among those who used to rely on MS Office completely. In certain institutions like big business and enterprise, cloud-based subscription Office will certainly sell to the BYOD crowd. For the rest of the folks who don't need it or have already jumped ship... well... I'm not sure about that. The users are going to look the same, the difference here is that the subscription model will push these folks from a desktop/Windows only model to a "use your desktop and your iPad/Android/Windows tablet" model.