LHR for current gen cards are a horrible idea

noko said:
Nvidia is sure making it ripe for AMD. If Intel can push CPU sells away from AMD (Also if AMD planned for such an occurrence), AMD can shift foundry skews to more GPUs and still sell everything they produced at high prices. Almost as if Nvidia is giving AMD a huge break/bone here. Nvidia Super series incoming? When? Price and availability?
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The thing is, there's no room in the lineup for "Super" cards. They have already milked every Cuda core combination from 3584 (3060) to 10496 (3090) with various memory specs all the way up the lineup. What's going to be the difference between the 3060 Super and the 3070 non-Ti? The 3060Ti is already knocking on the doors of the 3070 as it is.
 
kirbyrj said:
The thing is, there's no room in the lineup for "Super" cards. They have already milked every Cuda core combination from 3584 (3060) to 10496 (3090) with various memory specs all the way up the lineup. What's going to be the difference between the 3060 Super and the 3070 non-Ti? The 3060Ti is already knocking on the doors of the 3070 as it is.
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Maybe's: Cheaper redesign, easier to obtain components, higher MSRPs, a surprise Samsung 5nm version (doubtful). What Nvidia appears to be doing is making no sense, which makes me believe we don't have enough information dealing with Nvidia plans. Plus is Nvidia making a ton of lower end skews to starve off the launch of Intel release? Intel Ponte Vecchio to work with ARM servers directly competing with Nvidia should scare Nvidia big time as well. Nvidia just dropping out of the gaming market at Christmas time is beyond baffling. Preemptive move to starve and then saturate the market prior to Intel release? Nvidia do like to make bold moves, even very bad ones. I guess it keeps them on their toes, tense and ready to fight.
 
Lol I basically read in this thread "It's okay guys, mining is exempt from electron migration and our cards are worth more than ex-gaming cards because we know tech".
The crypto cult is strong lol.
 
kirbyrj said:
The thing is, there's no room in the lineup for "Super" cards. They have already milked every Cuda core combination from 3584 (3060) to 10496 (3090) with various memory specs all the way up the lineup. What's going to be the difference between the 3060 Super and the 3070 non-Ti? The 3060Ti is already knocking on the doors of the 3070 as it is.
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Many ways to get around it. Discontinue old cards, charge more for new cards that might get 5 percent more performance. Discontinue both the 3060ti and 3070. Leave the 3070 ti. Replace 3060 ti with super except charge 479 msrp. Then replaced the 3080 with the 3080 super at 200 more.

Oem's will adjust the prices higher, more profit.
 
N4CR said:
Lol I basically read in this thread "It's okay guys, mining is exempt from electron migration and our cards are worth more than ex-gaming cards because we know tech".
The crypto cult is strong lol.
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Actually, the implication was the cards are worth no less than ex-gaming cards, but no worries you can straw man a little more.

Nobody mentioned electron migration anywhere in the debate. But since you did mention it, generally more electron migration takes place the harder you run something, which in your example would be gaming. We already discussed how mining isn't actually running a card that hard in terms of voltage and temperature.
 
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noko said:
Well then LHR totally failed it purpose, limited your options while at the same time the prices went up while availability went down. Yet you think it is a good idea. OK.
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I said it's a step in the right direction to having two product lines. I don't think anybody thinks it solved anything.

Of course there are supply issues. However, GPUs are an investment for miners. Ethereum price dipped and in late spring/early summer and started surging back up late summer. I don't expect an investment to get any cheaper when it becomes more profitable and more popular with the general public.

I also don't think nvidia would be incompetent enough to disrupt supply when making the switch to LHR. They would make the change smoothly.
 
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3dprophet said:
I said it's a step in the right direction to having two product lines. I don't think anybody thinks it solved anything.

Of course there are supply issues. However, GPUs are an investment for miners. Ethereum price dipped and in late spring/early summer and started surging back up late summer. I don't expect an investment to get any cheaper when it becomes more profitable and more popular with the general public.

I also don't think nvidia would be incompetent enough to disrupt supply when making the switch to LHR. They would make the change smoothly.
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Why would you think it is a step in the right direction when they cut out a "feature" (albeit one you don't use) from their mainstream product line to enhance their ability to sell a different line? This has nothing to do with "getting cards in the hands of gamers" and everything to do with bilking customers into buying their damaged GPUs.

When does it end? I'm guessing the NVENC is the next thing to go and there will be an upcharge for the "feature" you used to get included.
 
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kirbyrj said:
Why would you think it is a step in the right direction when they cut out a "feature" (albeit one you don't use) from their mainstream product line to enhance their ability to sell a different line? This has nothing to do with "getting cards in the hands of gamers" and everything to do with bilking customers into buying their damaged GPUs.
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If they can make a zero HR card then gamers wouldn't directly compete for supply with miners.

If they can sell damaged GPUs that they normally wouldn't be able to sell, that increases supply, so I see it as positive as well.

Anyways, these are the reasons why I personally like the idea of LHR. Not everyone likes the same thing.
 
3dprophet said:
If they can make a zero HR card then gamers wouldn't directly compete for supply with miners.

If they can sell damaged GPUs that they normally wouldn't be able to sell, that increases supply, so I see it as positive as well.

Anyways, these are the reasons why I personally like the idea of LHR. Not everyone likes the same thing.
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Yes they would compete, GPU's allotted to Miner cards are less GPU's for gamers. Foundries cannot magically create additional space if product lines are split. Except now the gamer has less chance of getting a gaming card if those miner cards just sit in some warehouse not being bought, those GPU's would be useless for gamers. This only helps Nvidia in the end.
 
So far I like the Zotac 3070 amp holo lhr .. everything switced over and same power supply but now I can play GTA5 and it's very quiet and the power useage is not much more then what a RX 570 would use .

edit, forgot my dumbazz was trying out a game controller and didn't know the buttons .

 
undertaker2k8 said:
Very interesting read:
https://0xbypass.weebly.com/methods...le-methods-for-bypassing-the-3060-ti-lhr-mode
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Not really. It's an undergrad student basically saying "hey guys, if we can break cryptographic signatures or steal the keys, then LHR is defeated". Like no shit.

If there's an avenue of attack - it's probably the GPU authenticating the driver blob. But doesn't seem like nVidia made mistakes there.

Edit: Now this is a interesting potential attack: https://gist.githubusercontent.com/...b2612ab62998243ce5e7877496466cabb77f/tsec.txt

Obviously that's the Nintendo Switch up above, but in theory a similar method could be used to extract keys from any falcon based system.
 
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