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Diablo 3 Discussion Thread
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D
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I'm just not a huge fan of only using the AH for gear, wish I could find something decent to use every once in a while through playing. So far found one upgrade that wasn't 5-6 levels below me. Rare's are a lot worse than magic items.
I don't have a real reason to complain though to be honest, I stopped playing.
No what he's saying (and he can clarify if he likes) is that they will never make any changes or updates to it in order to fix or address player issues.
He says the game you play today is how it will always be. That's just not true.
Intel_Hydralisk
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I'm not quite sure that essay really got it "right".
If it weren't for the whining from the internets, I would have no clue that the AH was an "issue". No one that I actually play the game with has ever complained about the AH.
He assumes that people don't feel as rewarded for finding an item just to sell. I find it pretty rewarding to find an item that sells well on the AH even if it's not a direct upgrade for my character (yesterday I found a 1117 DPS bow, it's worse than mine but it sold for a hefty amount so I was happy... and like I mentioned earlier in this thread, I found a 1030 dps monk fist and sold it for bling bling and was likewise "rewarded" with satisfaction). While you won't necessarily find the exact item you need all the time, this is hardly a departure from D2.
He also incorrectly assumes that people don't find the AH fun and that getting gear off of it ruins the experience. I know a lot of people that enjoy digging through the AH to find that perfect item for them or to find a good deal.
I think to clarify things, there are two distinctly different parts of the game at play both of which use the AH model:
1. The leveling part (normal through hell to 60).
2. The Inferno part (the "end game"... you're at 60 and you need to gear up to tackle inferno).
For the most part, #1 does not need the AH at all from personal experience. He does have a point that since the AH is the path of least resistance, people will use it if not only due to a weak will. But I don't think this is a flaw in the system. The game is perfectly beatable through hell without the AH if you really wanted to.
For #2, I don't see why it's unreasonable to expect to trade for items to progress through Inferno. This just seems like common sense to me. Why should this incredibly difficult stage of the game be beatable simply from stuff that you yourself find from 30-50 hours of gameplay? People seem to simultaneously want the game to have longevity and also want to overcome the biggest challenge with no time / effort.
I think his best quote is this:
This pretty much hits the nail on the head. I find it puzzling that D2 players would have such rampant ADHD in D3. I find it likely that most people have a distorted memory of D2 (or simply botted in D2) or never played D2 and don't realize that the grind in this game is repeated farming runs.
If it weren't for the whining from the internets, I would have no clue that the AH was an "issue". No one that I actually play the game with has ever complained about the AH.
He assumes that people don't feel as rewarded for finding an item just to sell. I find it pretty rewarding to find an item that sells well on the AH even if it's not a direct upgrade for my character (yesterday I found a 1117 DPS bow, it's worse than mine but it sold for a hefty amount so I was happy... and like I mentioned earlier in this thread, I found a 1030 dps monk fist and sold it for bling bling and was likewise "rewarded" with satisfaction). While you won't necessarily find the exact item you need all the time, this is hardly a departure from D2.
He also incorrectly assumes that people don't find the AH fun and that getting gear off of it ruins the experience. I know a lot of people that enjoy digging through the AH to find that perfect item for them or to find a good deal.
I think to clarify things, there are two distinctly different parts of the game at play both of which use the AH model:
1. The leveling part (normal through hell to 60).
2. The Inferno part (the "end game"... you're at 60 and you need to gear up to tackle inferno).
For the most part, #1 does not need the AH at all from personal experience. He does have a point that since the AH is the path of least resistance, people will use it if not only due to a weak will. But I don't think this is a flaw in the system. The game is perfectly beatable through hell without the AH if you really wanted to.
For #2, I don't see why it's unreasonable to expect to trade for items to progress through Inferno. This just seems like common sense to me. Why should this incredibly difficult stage of the game be beatable simply from stuff that you yourself find from 30-50 hours of gameplay? People seem to simultaneously want the game to have longevity and also want to overcome the biggest challenge with no time / effort.
I think his best quote is this:
This pretty much hits the nail on the head. I find it puzzling that D2 players would have such rampant ADHD in D3. I find it likely that most people have a distorted memory of D2 (or simply botted in D2) or never played D2 and don't realize that the grind in this game is repeated farming runs.
cageymaru
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Well my point is that if you don't like the direction this game has taken then what's the point in hoping that the developers are going to magically change their thinking of what is fun for you. At this point I would recommend deleting the game off your hard drive. There might be tweaks but the base game's core values aren't going to change.
But I also recommended another game that has a different take on the genre for those that enjoy the genre but don't like Diablo III. For those of us that want a great AAA+ experience with a different twist with a low cost to try I think Path of Exile is a great choice. It is more fun for me than Diablo III. It isn't easier per se; just more fun.
Honestly if you detest something then why would you buy an expansion for it from the same team that doesn't share your idea of fun? Wouldn't that be a complete waste of money? But if you like the current game's core values and think it just needs a few tweaks to meet your definition of fun then by all means stick around for the continued support.
LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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You didn't need a Zod to be 99 and have everything on permafarm.
If anyone wants to do Act 3/4 raids/ farm / just play send me a pm or add my real ID: [email protected].
I am still playing and enjoying this game. It's simply a game. If you don't like it, play something else. Anyone who is still playing, feel free to hit me up. I got my DH to 60 and now I am working on leveling up a barbarian and a witch doctor, although the wizard looks to be the most interesting.
I am still playing and enjoying this game. It's simply a game. If you don't like it, play something else. Anyone who is still playing, feel free to hit me up. I got my DH to 60 and now I am working on leveling up a barbarian and a witch doctor, although the wizard looks to be the most interesting.
You needed pretty good gear to tele Hell Baal. Bet it wouldn't be going on much in the first couple weeks with no hacking/duping/botting.
I speak from a HC player perspective though. Obviously softies will just tele and die some along the way.
cageymaru
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Yes you hit the nail on the head. For me the game was too easy at the start with which made going through Normal boring for me as I played these type of games to break ever pot, container, chest, lore etc. By the time I got to something that was more challenging I had seen it all before and then it had to rely on it's replay value. Replay value for me equals incremental upgrades. Nothing that's going to make me into a god, but a piece or two per Act would have been nice. They didn't even have to be good enough to get me into the next difficulty; or even a side grade would have been nice, just something that says good job.
The game doesn't do that for me. AH Tycoon is what I played the last two years of WoW and I put that game behind me years ago. Pointless to continue playing what doesn't fit my perception of what is fun. For some AH Tycoon is new and fresh for them. They also like the one shot tactics in the game as it ramps up the danger aspect of the game. For me death in Diablo III is just a button on my screen that gives me a bathroom break. There isn't a reason for death in Diablo III as it doesn't affect your ability to progress in the game. Die, live, skip mobs; none of it affects your game.
There are many other reasons I don't like the game but those are just a few that irk me the most. And those are enough reasons to not continue for me.
Thx for reading my little rant.
D
Deleted member 232162
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I think it's just a trend I noticed, for me anyway, with Blizzard's games. They're all so similar in the sense that you play through the game with one character, then you kind of have to do the same thing all over again, albeit with a different character. Not knocking on their recipe, since a lot of other games do the same thing. But it just burns me out to no end. I went through Normal and Nightmare, and then several other friends wanted to play and we started over, and that's when the 'Shit, this is boring' switched flipped for me. Same thing happened in WoW, leveling alts. was fun for the first few levels, then you do the math in your head, "Crap I already did this like, 5 times, all for a few different looking spells? Fuck that.", then I turn the game off and go do something else.
Notdoingitrite =P
D
Deleted member 232162
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What is doing it right though? I just have a very short attention span it seems the older I get. Though I seem to be going the other way again while playing Arkham City the last few days. I'm constantly going from mission to mission enjoying myself. Unlike with WoW or Diablo, where I always feel like shit just won't end (not that that's a bad thing necessarily). I guess as I grow older I kind of just want to finish a game and be done with it, and not have to "ok, go do more now, but the same shit". I'm not saying that I don't want to not play these types of games, it's just increasingly difficult.
Going off on another tangent, I can see myself playing Planetside 2, since I never grew bored of the first one.
Master_of_Sparks
Limp Gawd
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Depending on the class you played you needed mediocre at best gear to tele hell Baal.
timtheenchantor
Gawd
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Unfortunately I think most people who are not happy have that same mindset maybe? I mean, Diablo has always been exactly what you describe. I'm not sure how else to "fix" the game when that is what it's based on.
With no maphack?
Riiiiiight. Lag for a second on ghosts and it's over.
Like I said, on SC, it doesn't matter.
D
Deleted member 232162
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That's exactly what I'm saying though, there's no "fix" to it. It's just the type of game that it is. You can't expect a Toyota to be as nice as a Ferrari, but then again you wouldn't want to. I think I'm just leaning more towards different types of games at this point in life.
cageymaru
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Well see Intel_Hydralisk for you this is fun! You love listing items on the AH. I find it tedious and boring. When I have to go to the AH I know it's time to logout as I have run out of things to do that are fun. I mean it's so boring that I'd rather run back through a level 3 times to find another pot to break that I missed rather than try to use the laggy AH.
I'm the guy that never got an upgrade from killing every mob on every Act multiple times through Act III of Hell mode. Now you can call it "expecting too much from the game" as I should have to run Normal 100 times to get gear for Nightmare and then Nightmare 100 times to get gear for Hell, but I was under the impression that's what you did in Hell to gear for inferno. That the other Acts were just there to breeze through on your merry way to start the end game. So here I am forced to use the laggy beast called the AH. And bored senseless I might add.
I guess for me having played mostly MUDS, MMO's etc from 1991 until now that I'm tired of searching AH's for stuff that I feel should at least have a lower tier equivalent in the game. I'll kill a boss or elite 1000X over if I know I have a chance at something. Without incremental rewards there isn't a point to the game for me as I don't find farming for gold to be exciting. I'd rather not play than farm gold. I farm all my gold as a byproduct of having fun killing elites that might drop what I need to progress; not because I find it fun.
When I realized what the game was really about I realized the game is dead for me. I just don't see why I shouldn't tell my [H] brethren that are fence sitting on this title why it's not fun for me.
I like the fact that you and others are telling everyone why it is fun for you. That way they can compare and contrast our statements on the state of the game and make a well informed decision.
Master_of_Sparks
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Only scrubs used maphack.
D
Deleted member 232162
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QFT x 1000.
I think we're all split on this throughout the thread. It's fun for some, it's awful for others.
Master_of_Sparks said:
I think you quoted the wrong person.
Yoshiyuki Blade
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Yay, just found a nice legendary item! (Andariel's Visage). It has some pretty nice stats, but I'm not sure what its value will go for. The AH has an enormous price range for the helm. When I looked for versions with similar "main stats" (str/vit) it went well into the million gold range.
I'm not sure whether to sell it on the AH or give/sell it to my friend who just recently started a Barb.
I'm not sure whether to sell it on the AH or give/sell it to my friend who just recently started a Barb.
cageymaru
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I feel the need to quantify what an incremental upgrade is. An upgrade that is slightly better than what you have but is missing all the good stuff that you really want. Rares that have it all aren't what I'm passionate about although kill Boss X 50 times and finally getting it is fun. It's the little crappy upgrades so i know that I'm doing it right. In this game all I get are maybe upgrades for another class and I'm off to AH wizard to hope I can buy / trade what I need to progress to the next elite pack. Zzzzzz 
Yea, he did.
Scrub or not, maphack or not, you'll die once in 100 runs with mediocre gear.
cageymaru
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Give it to your friend so you'll can have fun together.
I have zero problems farming for good items. I don't mind clearing a zone multiple times, part of the game IMO, part of the enjoyment of the series!
My problem is the way item drops are handled. I have found hardly anything useable. In diablo 2 I found enough items to progress and upgrade my character. I found items I couldn't use yet and had to wait a level or two! That was awesome. Only played with a few friends, never went to trade, never had to. We might not have had the best items but we could play the game with what we found.
Out of the last 100 yellows my DH has found he has only used two, saved 6 for my wizard of which he ended up using only 3, sold about 10 on the auction hall, the rest was garbage. I have about 30 yellows not sold in my AH waiting for me because even selling these worthless items at 500g with a buyout of 1 or 2k no one wants them. They are useless, I don't even want to take the time to send them to my stash to sell off because I could make more gold killing mobs in the time that would take.
I'm consistently getting drops with item levels ten levels below the level of my characters. It is not rewarding to kill the last boss of the game and get nothing usable for that character or even a lower level alt. The reward for me in these games is finding the loot and being valuable in some way, more often than not I find the loot and am disappointed because it is worthless.
I don't think I should be getting a legendary with each boss kill or even once a difficulty level...I also shouldn't get a legendary wand with strength and dexterity on it that is weaker than a random blue.
I'm still enjoying the game. But unless there are some changes I doubt this game will have the lasting appeal for me that diablo 2 did.
You can definitely play game normal through hell and never use the AH.
timtheenchantor
Gawd
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That's the thing though. You recognize it may not be the game for you. Others though, just blame the game.
Intel_Hydralisk
Supreme [H]ardness
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The DEX ones sell for a ton because this is the best DPS helm for a DH (oh my god, did I just say that a Legendary is the best at something?? What's GOING ON!? I thought legendary itemization was garbage?!?!?!)
Most of the cheaper ones will be STR ones. For a Barb/Monk, Mempo is generally better due to the life / resist all stats instead of the crit chance. The INT ones are generally in the middle.
Of course there are also X factor properties like a socket.
cageymaru
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No, not a true statement. I had to buy blues off the AH to play Nightmare and Hell as I personally didn't even get an upgrade for my blues from killing bosses. I made my level 60 buddy come run with me and I was begging him for anything with Dexterity on it that might drop for him. I actually got Inferno quality Barbarian gear that made him happy as hell. He never got a piece of Barbarian gear from drops but I was rolling in it. He gave me two upgrades from the runs.
If I didn't know him I would have had to purchase my upgrades from the AH as that's where they would have gone as he would have done also. But we worked together to make the game work for us.
His family quit yesterday to go back to playing LoL as they too finds the game boring and tedious. I never even told him that I was bored senseless also as I was just trying to catch up with him so we could do Inferno in a 4 man group. Oh well.
Yoshiyuki Blade
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Yeah, I noticed there were a ton of str ones going for about 300k, mosty around the 120 str range. I happened to roll relatively higher in the 150s and with about 60 vit.
It seems like a great helm overall. The IAS even made it a DPS boost over my Wizard's helm, which has over 100 Int. Yeah, my gear is really that bad.
D
Deleted member 232162
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Pretty much.
Are you saying you expect to go through the game linearly and not repeat anything and progress all the way to the end of hell?
I don't think that's realistic.
Maybe you are one of the unlucky ones. I didn't buy anything off the ah until act4 hell. The only reason why I did was because I needed more HP. Hell after killing my first yellow in inferno a 590dps rare bow dropped which was a huge upgrade for me.
Maplehamwich
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So far, I keep finding Demon Hunter items on all of my characters. That is, except for when I play my Demon Hunter...
D
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LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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Eh, if I can still enjoy D1, D2, Titan Quest and Path of Exile, I'd say some of what bothers me is specific to D3.
It's still fun enough to play, and I'm definitely not asking for a refund. I just think I'd be moving on if I didn't have friends playing.
Same I keep getting Barb items when I play on my DH..... Started doing Inferno Warden to Butcher runs in groups of 4 last night, definitely saw better items drop with 4 people. I got lvl 54 quiver with 12 unique stats instead of the usual 3 or 4, sadly its not an upgrade over what I bought out of the AH for 10k gold...
I am starting to think they up'd the chance of finding Legendary Items with the last patch.
I put in 80 hours 2 runs all the way to inferno act 2 and found 0 legendary Items.
Past 8 hours of playing and I have found 7, could just be luck but that is some fucked up shit if it is.
I put in 80 hours 2 runs all the way to inferno act 2 and found 0 legendary Items.
Past 8 hours of playing and I have found 7, could just be luck but that is some fucked up shit if it is.
Intel_Hydralisk
Supreme [H]ardness
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I played thousands of hours of D2, but at this point I'm thinking it was likely because I was 13-15 years old.
I did play TQ and enjoyed it - but only for 50ish hours. I did play torchlight and enjoyed it for the most part - for a similar amount of time. So I can't really compare and honestly they don't compare to D3 which I've already put more time in than those two combined.
That's the RNG for ya.
When the game came out a group of 4 of us cleared to inferno the 2nd day.. none of us used the AH. You are incorrect sir.