Tamlin_WSGF
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2006
- Messages
- 3,123
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It's interesting how nobody even mentions all the horribly bad things about Win8 and I'm not talking about the UI now.
App store is a slap in the face to many content distributors such as Valve and EA. Win8 also introduces a whole new level of built in spyware, MS holds the right to monitor basically everything you have on the computer and even choose for you if you can run certain programs. MS can remove programs from your computer at will if it sees it necessary. Win8 introduces 'secure boot' which is nothing but an attempt to further lock down the hardware and OS from end users and restrict people from using open source alternatives.
With Win8 users have less control of their computer than ever before - and if this trend gets supported MS is going to lock down the whole OS so tight it's going to be nothing more than a gaming console with paid office (free versions will be banned due to no code signging) and a bunch of MS approved apps that have 30% inflated prices due to MS tax.
Heh, which do you think the hardware manufacturers are going to side on? Rebelious consumer or MS payolas? If this trend is allowed to continue without a total revolt, soon there will be a day where you can only buy totally locked down hardware.
Did you even bother to read the article?
People mention it, but most of it is speculations of what "could happen". I am a strong supporter of open standards (to the point that when or if Ubuntu becomes a fully supported gaming system, I might use only that), but I still have the ability to see positive sides with new software. The article I posted shows some of the benifits you get from upgrading from windows 7 to windows 8.
Its not a matter of perspective, those benifits are there, every benifit listed in that article.
Steam, Origin, Blizzard and others are all promoting their own closed system, where they get percentage of each game they sell. That we now have a MS app store with a new OS that also is build for use on mobile systems shouldn't come as a shock to anyone.
Windows 8 is still a system where you can have several app stores. There is nothing I cannot do on Windows 8 that I couldn't do on Windows 7. Infact, I have more options with windows 8 then what I ever had with windows 7.
The start menu in windows 7 sucks bigtime and have always sucked bigtime. The tree structure is horrible to navigate, much of what is installed, gets installed after the manufacturers name and not the product name. So, if I install Dirt 2, I have to navigate through programs -> codemasters -> dirt 2. That sucks so much, that I had a lot of programs pinned on top of the start menu, just for quicker access instead of the painfull tree navigation. Some, I stuck on the taskbar for quicker access.
With windows 8, I can still have the grouping (under all apps) by name, but I have a much larger place to pin apps to for a quick winkey access. Since I have several screens, windows 8 have natively given me more realestate when it comes to pinning items on taskbar.
Its all OK for me that some misses the old start menu. I'm not the one to post in all threads telling them how much I disagree. I have problems though understanding what they really liked with the old tree navigation style menu of win 7 though.
Of course I read it. The thinking behind the article was very very narrow and optimistic. Money rules the hardware ecosystem, ideology such as depicted in the article will never prosper.
I'd have to say that you suck at installing software....especially the part where you can choose the directory and folder names.....
Just installed Batman Arkham city and the folder path is c:\games\batman arkham city\ The folder on the start menu is all programs->games-Batman Arkham City and there is a shorcut the the executable......it's called chosing a custom install...
Did you give that directory appropriate permissions during install? You know, deny user write, allow user read, allow Admin read/write? Do you think everyone should do that every time they install for a bunch of custom directories? Do you think people have no need of the permissions in place on the default program files directory? Inquiring minds want to know. Also some apps don't respond well not being in their default directory, and you never know which ones until it breaks, so I generally would avoid that personally, got enough things keeping me busy.
Why on earth would you deny user write permissions to a game folder? LOL!
Same reason you deny to any program folder. One would be to keep other users from being able to purposefully or accidently tamper with the files. Another, to keep malware from a browser/download that's not sandboxed from being able to corrupt it. Just because your particular desires and needs don't encompass that, doesn't mean others' don't, especially given the context of that 'tip' is to tell others they should do it, without knowing their situation. There's probably other reasons, try looking up why \program files\ is not user-writeable, also this is not just for games that was just the example.
So let me get this right: You're going to deny write permissions to the game folder where the game is going to want to write ini changes, files, databases etc? Are you going to run your games as administrator then or what?
Or are you now referring to the root folder 'games'? If so, what imaginable benefit would you get from having admin only access to the root and yet have to open access to the subfolders?
What other users do you think will be on your desktop tampering with your games? And why do you think a malware would care for a second if user level access has been taken away since infection usually requires privilege escalation in the first place? Once you've been pwned you're pwned and folder permissions are a joke at that stage.
First of all, for the second time, that game is an example, how does it help to install only one thing or one type or thing to custom directories.
Second, it is not about who is going to tamper with my games on my desktop, because nobody else uses my computer, it's about everybody and who uses their computers. Hint, if you're a dad or a mom, you don't want to install programs to user write-able directories, then let your kid play on your computer (ostensibly to learn), for *example*.
Third, programs that install by default to "\program files" do not store settings in .ini's in their program directory, because they aren't allowed to by default permissions.
Fourthly, an infection does not require admin, probably not even usually (what is usually anyway, >50%? Then do you have a source that says that >50% of malware does so? Hardly makes a difference when 49% will clean your clock.) Cliff notes: This is not a universal solution, regardless of whether you care about just games, on just your system.
I'd have to say that you suck at installing software....especially the part where you can choose the directory and folder names.....
Just installed Batman Arkham city and the folder path is c:\games\batman arkham city\ The folder on the start menu is all programs->games-Batman Arkham City and there is a shorcut the the executable......it's called chosing a custom install...
Virtually everyone loves Windows 8.
It's only a small selection of miffed teens who think they're enthusiasts which bleat about such nonsense.
Rest assured all us adults are having a great time playing with the new UI
I think most people, even those that complain about win 8 like it.
The majority of complaints is either about the start menu (which is a matter of preferences, even though I personally thinks the old win 7 tree structure menu always have been awful)
or
its about being able to run apps on Win 8. Which basically is an option, not a requirement. I only use metro as a launch menu and search menu, but its nice to have an option to use metro apps on my desktop if I get a Win 8 mobile or laptop later.
The article I linked in the OP, shows indisputable upgrades under the hood for Windows 8 vs. Windows 7. Nobody has complained or disputed those advantages, only that they were positive about Windows 8, which some obviously didn't like. ;P
Steam is my preferred source for games, but I still find it funny that some complain that M$ would take a money cut from developers for sales through their app store. Valve takes 30% from developers for games sold on Steam. EA wanted their share and started Origin, which I find less polished then Steam. EA also removed a lot of their titles from Steam as result.
Still, its a funny how some rage over the fact that M$ also wants their share for game sales through an app store, pointing how bad this is for Steam...
Yet Valve and other distributors have bashed Win8 like no tomorrow even to the extent that Newell started a linux migration.
I couldn't care less if Steam takes 30% cut when I can get 80% discount deals on it that I can't find on any retailer - and the system works. On MS app store it's going to be a different story alltogether. For some reason the same developers who are happy to use Steam are refusing to even consider the app store
Of course they have. Steam is Valves bread and butter. I love the fact that Win 8 pushed Steam to support Linux, since I am a big fan of Ubuntu (and also Unity, since I never liked a tree structured start menu). Steam moving to Linux is one of the best things that's happened this year, since gaming is the primary reason I haven't moved to Ubuntu fully already.
You think MS app store is going to be a different story, but I can tell you its going to be the same story: Steam sells games, Steam takes a cut of the sales from the developers. M$ sells games, M$ is going to take a cut of the sales from the developers.
All the electronic retailers have sales and deals, including M$'s Games for Windows. Did you think Steam was exclusive on that?
I have serious issues to believe MS is going to have 'weekend deals' like Steam. When was the last time you saw Office or Windows for 80% off? Never. Nah, not gonna happen.
Though I prefer Steam, I've bought several games on sale through games for windows. Sometimes ordinary titles are cheaper through windows marketplace too.
Windows 8 doesn't remove any option to use Origin, Blizzard, Steam or any other place to buy the games, so its not an issue really.
Seems you are making issues that are not there. Why? Is windows 8 so great that you have to invent issues?
Quite the contrary. The distributors are the ones making the issues and for a very good reason. You see they can see the big picture. Win8, code signing, app market... they're all baby steps into a locked down windows ecosystem where apps like steam will work after jailbreaking the secure booted OS
It's heading there folks, and as MS has predicted the consumers are too ignorant to realize it before its too late. Doesn't matter to me. I'm as happy as you IF linux will gain foothold as a gaming platform. Unfortunately Steam and 1 source engine gameplatform makes not.
You are forgetting the most basic thing: M$ is not going to close Steam on Windows 8, they are not going to close Origin on Windows 8, they are not going to close Blizzard on Windows 8 and as you can see, you can run Steam games on Windows 8 just as you can with Windows 7. Windows 8 is giving you more options when it comes to buying games, not less. Thats what Valve and the others fear. M$ creating a better alternative, not that they are going to close Steam as we see it today.
Its good that you find Windows 8 so great you have to invent issues that are not there to make a point.
Are you blind or what? Haven't you read any of the articles released on why the distributors are bashing W8? They're not disabled, yet. Emphasis on the yet part.
MS is probing the ice to see if it can pull off making windows an iOS like closed platform. The distributors are totally panicing over it because it will mean the end to their business model. They seem to take it seriously enough, even if you won't!
I've a lot of the articles. They are bitching about their access to M$'s store, not that M$ is going to close Steam, Origin, Blizzard etc and block them from Windows 8. Not even Macs OSX have closed off Steam from their systems.
Steam and other providers will still have access to Win 8 desktop, just as they had to Win 7 desktop. Its Metro thats providing M$ with their own closed solution, just as Steam provides Valve with their own closed solution.
Its good that you find Windows 8 so great you have to invent issues that are not there to make a point.
I've a lot of the articles. They are bitching about their access to M$'s store, not that M$ is going to close Steam, Origin, Blizzard etc and block them from Windows 8. Not even Macs OSX have closed off Steam from their systems.
Steam and other providers will still have access to Win 8 desktop, just as they had to Win 7 desktop. Its Metro thats providing M$ with their own closed solution, just as Steam provides Valve with their own closed solution.
Its good that you find Windows 8 so great you have to invent issues that are not there to make a point.
Oh right, that must be the reason why one dist. moves to linux and the other makes statements like 'prefer not to sell if it means staying out of W8'
It's good that you find your rose colored MS glasses so thick that you must invent totally bogus anecdotes like that. No wait. It's not good.
Oh right, that must be the reason why one dist. moves to linux and the other makes statements like 'prefer not to sell if it means staying out of W8'
It's good that you find your rose colored MS glasses so thick that you must invent totally bogus anecdotes like that. No wait. It's not good.
If there's one thing Windows 8 proponents excel at, it's condescension.Rest assured all us adults are having a great time playing with the new UI
Oh right, that must be the reason why one dist. moves to linux and the other makes statements like 'prefer not to sell if it means staying out of W8'
It's good that you find your rose colored MS glasses so thick that you must invent totally bogus anecdotes like that. No wait. It's not good.
If there's one thing Windows 8 proponents excel at, it's condescension.
I've not yet seen them excel at anything else in particular.
It's interesting how nobody even mentions all the horribly bad things about Win8 and I'm not talking about the UI now.
App store is a slap in the face to many content distributors such as Valve and EA. Win8 also introduces a whole new level of built in spyware, MS holds the right to monitor basically everything you have on the computer and even choose for you if you can run certain programs. MS can remove programs from your computer at will if it sees it necessary. Win8 introduces 'secure boot' which is nothing but an attempt to further lock down the hardware and OS from end users and restrict people from using open source alternatives.
With Win8 users have less control of their computer than ever before - and if this trend gets supported MS is going to lock down the whole OS so tight it's going to be nothing more than a gaming console with paid office (free versions will be banned due to no code signging) and a bunch of MS approved apps that have 30% inflated prices due to MS tax.
I think most people, even those that complain about win 8 like it.
The majority of complaints is either about the start menu (which is a matter of preferences, even though I personally thinks the old win 7 tree structure menu always have been awful)
or
its about being able to run apps on Win 8. Which basically is an option, not a requirement. I only use metro as a launch menu and search menu, but its nice to have an option to use metro apps on my desktop if I get a Win 8 mobile or laptop later.
Bullshit, please go learn how to use computers and then come back when you have. Facts are facts and yours are not.
Its no rose colored glasses. On the contrary. The reason why Gabe and Valve complain, is all about the money. Thats the same reason why M$ have their own store and thats the reason why game developers doesn't make all their games open source. Even the sales are there to make $$$. They don't have sales for charity.
Steam is not moving to Linux. They are opening for distribution on Linux in addition to Windows 7 and windows 8 desktop.
You must be pretty paranoid if you believe that M$ is going to block Steam from Windows 8 desktop. As heatlesssun pointed out, all M$ would gain in such a move, would be loads of lawsuits. There is no reason for M$ to do that.
What Steam fears, is the competition M$ can bring with their own store.
Consumers would still be able to buy their games off Steam, but they might get a better, more streamlined and can even get a more feature rich game store if they support the smart glass feature through their games.
Windows 8 won't bring less options to buy games, but more. Whether or not Windows 9 would be more closed, depends on the market. But, complaining about windows 8, because windows 9 might be more closed, would be stupid.
Windows 8 might block Steam if hell freezes over and all lawyers die from frost, not before. Until then, stop talking as if M$ have blocked Steam already. It ain't going to happen on Windows 8.
Its good that you find Windows 8 so great you have to invent issues that are not there to make a point.