GPU recommended purely for 4K video play back?

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Gatecrasher3000

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Hi dudes, so I'm considering getting a new TV (maybe A95L that can do 120hz 4K) and this TV will be connected to my media server (i5 7700k, 1050ti, a bunch of 4-8TB drives you get the idea). Through this media server I stream content via netflix, prime video or mainly youtube on my 1gbs connection, also sometimes downloaded 4K HDR content. The 1050ti GPU I have been using over the last few years doesn't always seem to provide smooth video playback on my current 4K 60hz Sony TV, especially panning shots or ones with lots of movement.
What I really want to avoid is stutter on my new TV, so I want a GPU that can provide smooth video playback on all the formats I just mentioned, I don't believe this requires a 4090 or anything beefy at all (as long as it has HDMI 2.1 outputs) but I don't know what target I should shoot for in regards to GPU horsepower. When the NV 3000 series was getting released I remember hearing about something in the 3000s series feature set that allowed for smooth video playback so right now I'm considering a used 3060, but if any of you can suggest any other cards, or what target I should go for please let me know.

I guess this brings up another question, is it even my 1050ti that is causing the stutter on my current setup, or is there anything else I should look at as a cause?

Thank ya.
 
To note 24fps video will "stutter" and will be visible on fast panning are you experiencing something more than normal low fps ? It is only seen on panning shots and high movement it is maybe what you are seeing (a codec or not powerful enough to handle it I would think would have more generalized issues at any moment), is it happening only for harder to play specific codec or pretty much in general ?

For nexflix-prime-youtube-4k hdr content you can try your tv (they often have issues once the bitrate get any high too in my experience at least in the lower price range) or a amazon little 4k stick those have pretty much top and up to date media ability.

Intel quicksync-igpu are quite good at this, to be considered if you want the output to come from the machine, a 12100/13100 would give large CPU boost and a close to up to date media player.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...dware/1-1/overview.html#DECODE-OVERVIEW-11-12
from x265 to av1 10bit, 4:2:0
 
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I just bought a mini mini pc with 3 usb ports and 3x hdmi 4k/60 fps ports for way under 200 bucks. To be mounted behind a TV.

So it has become a questions of which iGPU of a CPU can handle it.

Do some research about the N95 vs N100 chips. I think they both have different iterations. The correct ones should suffice.
 
I see you have a 6800XT in the computer in your sig. Might try a temporary swap to see if stutters persist between cards.
No experience with 4k media server performance.
 
LukeTbk said:
To note 24fps video will "stutter" and will be visible on fast panning are you experiencing something more than normal low fps ? It is only seen on panning shots and high movement it is maybe what you are seeing, is it happening only for harder to play specific codec or pretty much in general ?

For nexflix-prime-youtube-4k hdr content you can try your tv (they often have issues once the bitrate get any high too in my experience at least in the lower price range) or a amazon little 4k stick those have pretty much top and up to date media ability
Click to expand...

Well this issue does have different reasons.

One of them is the inherent problem of montiors in general to cope with those slow fps/ panning shots. Did rtings.com do a review? They usually mention this stuff.
So finding out if the monitor in general has issues with low fps movies in forums would be the next step i would suggest.
 
Carlyle2020 said:
Well this issue does have different reasons.

One of them is the inherent problem of montiors in general to cope with those slow fps/ panning shots. Did rtings.com do a review? They usually mention this stuff.
So finding out if the monitor in general has issues with low fps movies in forums would be the next step i would suggest.
Click to expand...

If you don't want that stuttering on panning shots then you can turn on the motion enhancement feature of the TV. It will make it smooth and will give it the "Soap Opera" look.
I personally don't like that look since it makes the film look like a TV show shot on 30 FPS video.

I just tested my old i7 4770 in my Plex Server and the iGPU can play 4K movies but you can hear that it's working hard as the cpu fan ramps up and uses 50% cpu and 50% gpu as it plays.
So probably most iGPU's less than 10 years old will play 4K video just fine. My i7 4770 is 10 years old now.
 
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if i dont output at 24fps or use some type of smooth motion tv trickery i get stuttering in panning too. thats normal. you 1050ti should be able to handle it too, if the setup is configured properly.
what are you getting the stutter in, movie rips?
 
I too ran a media server with a 1050ti. Something didn't ever seem quite right with it for me. When I upgraded my main machine from the 1080ti to something newer I moved the 1080ti to the media server and it is very smooth.

I also have a secondary backup media server with a 1070ti and it also seems quite smooth.

My theory is the 1050ti doesn't have enough vram to deliver a great experience.

If you can find someone with an nvidia card with more vram to borrow for an hour, that would be great...no driver goofing around needed.
 
applegrcoug said:
I too ran a media server with a 1050ti.
Click to expand...
was it use for decoding media to be played by something else or directly connected to a tv ?


playing Gemini man (60fps, 4k) seem to add 900MB of vram usage, maybe it goes up if the card does not have hardware support for the current codec ?

Could be, 2GB is not a lot but the Amazon 4k stick that play about everything very well has 1.5GB of ram total, the max version goes to 2GB, OS and all fitting on it.

Even at 60 fps, a full 5 second of 4k video should not take that much ram in modern term.
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
Hi dudes, so I'm considering getting a new TV (maybe A95L that can do 120hz 4K) and this TV will be connected to my media server (i5 7700k, 1050ti, a bunch of 4-8TB drives you get the idea). Through this media server I stream content via netflix, prime video or mainly youtube on my 1gbs connection, also sometimes downloaded 4K HDR content. The 1050ti GPU I have been using over the last few years doesn't always seem to provide smooth video playback on my current 4K 60hz Sony TV, especially panning shots or ones with lots of movement.
What I really want to avoid is stutter on my new TV, so I want a GPU that can provide smooth video playback on all the formats I just mentioned, I don't believe this requires a 4090 or anything beefy at all (as long as it has HDMI 2.1 outputs) but I don't know what target I should shoot for in regards to GPU horsepower. When the NV 3000 series was getting released I remember hearing about something in the 3000s series feature set that allowed for smooth video playback so right now I'm considering a used 3060, but if any of you can suggest any other cards, or what target I should go for please let me know.
Click to expand...

For 4k you probably want at least 8gb of VRAM so you don't run out. The RTX 3060 is probably a good choice to have all the latest video playback boosting functions.

Walmart actually sells a 12GB low profile ITX version of the 3060 that might interest you.

Link: https://www.walmart.com/ip/MSI-GeFo...d_id=612734&campaign_id=9383&sharedid=6080654

The HDMI port on this card is specified as HDMI 2.1 for 4k @ 120hz.

https://www.msi.com/Graphics-Card/GeForce-RTX-3060-AERO-ITX-12G-OC
 
My Vero4K plays these videos without any issues (and has a lot less horsepower than the 1050Ti), I doubt it is the GPU. Even if someone else here has real issues with the same GPU, it might be a completely different issue (as mentioned before here in the thread).

Indeed, 24 (23.976 actually) fps inherently stutters on certain panning shots. Though the stutter is constant when done right, but if that is not the case, you are experiencing judder.

A lot of people say that high framerate (HFR) video is more natural than 24fps, but that isn't the case either. Turn your head quickly and see how you perceive that, not smooth at all, so HFR isn't natural at all (though what one likes better than someone else, is completely personal).

So the conclusion is, either you are experiencing natural 24fps panning stuttering (which is normal), you are experiencing judder (which can be solved by going 24/48/72/96/120/144/etc Hz and/or using a good video player that can show these framerates correctly), or there is something else going on.

I would advise you to read the link I put in under the word "judder" to first understand your issue exactly. I vividly remember my quest to "solve" this issue back in the day I started out building a home theater. The biggest issue is all the people saying this is wrong and only that is right, while the truth is, it is personal, but you need to understand what is going on before you can make that decision. If you still have an issue after you understand it, then come back and it will be a lot easier to troubleshoot.
 
I just played a 4K movie on my AMD 6800.... uses about 1% CPU and 7% GPU. No studder here. Monitor refresh rate is 120Hz however, which I've found to be helpful all around.
 
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Koldur said:
My Vero4K plays these videos without any issues (and has a lot less horsepower than the 1050Ti), I doubt it is the GPU. Even if someone else here has real issues with the same GPU, it might be a completely different issue (as mentioned before here in the thread).

Indeed, 24 (23.976 actually) fps inherently stutters on certain panning shots. Though the stutter is constant when done right, but if that is not the case, you are experiencing judder.

A lot of people say that high framerate (HFR) video is more natural than 24fps, but that isn't the case either. Turn your head quickly and see how you perceive that, not smooth at all, so HFR isn't natural at all (though what one likes better than someone else, is completely personal).

So the conclusion is, either you are experiencing natural 24fps panning stuttering (which is normal), you are experiencing judder (which can be solved by going 24/48/72/96/120/144/etc Hz and/or using a good video player that can show these framerates correctly), or there is something else going on.

I would advise you to read the link I put in under the word "judder" to first understand your issue exactly. I vividly remember my quest to "solve" this issue back in the day I started out building a home theater. The biggest issue is all the people saying this is wrong and only that is right, while the truth is, it is personal, but you need to understand what is going on before you can make that decision. If you still have an issue after you understand it, then come back and it will be a lot easier to troubleshoot.
Click to expand...
Yeahhhh because of everything I've read here, I'm starting to think I simply have been dealing with 24fps content... and not some hardware limitation... Also, my current TV is so old that the built in prime/netflix apps are so slow to use that I just use prime/netflix in a browser via the media server, and I've read there are limitations with video playback from a browser compared to an app built into the TV.
Alright thanks [H], so I probably don't need to upgrade my GPU, I simply just need a newer TV that has the ability to smooth out 24fps content, and has faster built in apps, something the A95L should help with.
 
Carlyle2020 said:
Well this issue does have different reasons.

One of them is the inherent problem of montiors in general to cope with those slow fps/ panning shots. Did rtings.com do a review? They usually mention this stuff.
So finding out if the monitor in general has issues with low fps movies in forums would be the next step i would suggest.
Click to expand...
Yeah I learned more last night after you guys mentioned it about 24fps jutter, and the problem I'm getting is probably that. It seems like many new TVs made today boast about how they can smooth 24fps contect, apperenrly the A95L I was looking at does this well.
pendragon1 said:
if i dont output at 24fps or use some type of smooth motion tv trickery i get stuttering in panning too. thats normal. you 1050ti should be able to handle it too, if the setup is configured properly.
what are you getting the stutter in, movie rips?
Click to expand...
Yes, movie rips, I guess I got it into my head that movies are made in 60fps, because much of the other content I view (youtube, twitch) is.
My jutter problem is probably all because of 24fps.
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
Yeah I learned more last night after you guys mentioned it about 24fps jutter, and the problem I'm getting is probably that. It seems like many new TVs made today boast about how they can smooth 24fps contect, apperenrly the A95L I was looking at does this well.

Yes, movie rips, I guess I got it into my head that movies are made in 60fps, because much of the other content I view (youtube, twitch) is.
My jutter problem is probably all because of 24fps.
Click to expand...
it is. if you set your player to output at 24fps it will look much better. i use media player classic and have set it to switch to all the different FPSs and it works muuuuuch better. i have 24, 30, 48, 50 and 60 fps modes.
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
Hi dudes, so I'm considering getting a new TV (maybe A95L that can do 120hz 4K) and this TV will be connected to my media server (i5 7700k, 1050ti, a bunch of 4-8TB drives you get the idea). Through this media server I stream content via netflix, prime video or mainly youtube on my 1gbs connection, also sometimes downloaded 4K HDR content. The 1050ti GPU I have been using over the last few years doesn't always seem to provide smooth video playback on my current 4K 60hz Sony TV, especially panning shots or ones with lots of movement.
What I really want to avoid is stutter on my new TV, so I want a GPU that can provide smooth video playback on all the formats I just mentioned, I don't believe this requires a 4090 or anything beefy at all (as long as it has HDMI 2.1 outputs) but I don't know what target I should shoot for in regards to GPU horsepower. When the NV 3000 series was getting released I remember hearing about something in the 3000s series feature set that allowed for smooth video playback so right now I'm considering a used 3060, but if any of you can suggest any other cards, or what target I should go for please let me know.

I guess this brings up another question, is it even my 1050ti that is causing the stutter on my current setup, or is there anything else I should look at as a cause?

Thank ya.
Click to expand...
Wait a little for 8700/8800G or whatever it will be named with unlocked 780M iGPU.
 
vjhawk said:
For 4k you probably want at least 8gb of VRAM so you don't run out.
Click to expand...
Do you have a source or it is something you track vram usage during playback ?

Lot of 2GB of total ram device play 4k content quite well. Usually online we will see that you need 6GB or 8GB for 4K movie editing, not simple playback.
 
LukeTbk said:
Do you have a source or it is something you track vram usage during playback ?

Lot of 2GB of total ram device play 4k content quite well. Usually online we will see that you need 6GB or 8GB for 4K movie editing, not simple playback.
Click to expand...
I can't remember the number, but vram gets to be an issue when you are transcoding...especially if you are doing multiple streams. For some reason, I have 1GB per 1080p stuck in my head. My issues did come when transcoding live content. My 1080ti handles live content far better. By the numbers, I dont know why, but it does.
 
Good info in this thread. I would also recommend trying to figure out why you're having playback issues. As it may not just be related to hardware. Though with hardware you can just brute force things. I used a Vega 20 in a Macbook Pro from 2019 until a few months ago, and that was a card sadly strapped with 4GB of vRAM, and it played back 4k stuff fine. I even edited 4k and 6k footage on said computer. While I wouldn't recommend the editing part, at the time it was my only option. Anyway, the point is even the 6k footage, playback was fine.

I'd also look into the specific codecs you're trying to decode, as you may have performance problems there. The greater amount of compression the video has, the harder it will be to decode and playback. In this case, faster hardware will help you.
There are also many flavors of h.265 and various pieces of hardware have only supported accelerating parts of the codec. Actually to my knowledge there isn't any graphics card or processor that supports acceleration of decoding every aspect of h.265. h.265 even has a 12-bit specification and a RAW specification and I know of nothing that supports acceleration either in decode or encode. Anyway, that's a tangent, the point is some cards/cpus only support 8-bit codecs or only 420. They may have a harder time with long-GOP decoding. Etc. So look at what it is you're having trouble with playing back, it may be more than just a resolution issue. It may really be a codec one.
 
applegrcoug said:
I can't remember the number, but vram gets to be an issue when you are transcoding...especially if you are doing multiple streams. For some reason, I have 1GB per 1080p stuck in my head. My issues did come when transcoding live content. My 1080ti handles live content far better. By the numbers, I dont know why, but it does.
Click to expand...
I could imagine that (it has to handle the different input and output data, the conversion step-code all at the same time, have more buffer), but the op seem to be plugging the computer directly to the tv (which I imagine can be ok with just 2-3 frame in memory at the same time), not a plexserver type situation
 
UnknownSouljer said:
Good info in this thread. I would also recommend trying to figure out why you're having playback issues. As it may not just be related to hardware. Though with hardware you can just brute force things. I used a Vega 20 in a Macbook Pro from 2019 until a few months ago, and that was a card sadly strapped with 4GB of vRAM, and it played back 4k stuff fine. I even edited 4k and 6k footage on said computer. While I wouldn't recommend the editing part, at the time it was my only option. Anyway, the point is even the 6k footage, playback was fine.

I'd also look into the specific codecs you're trying to decode, as you may have performance problems there. The greater amount of compression the video has, the harder it will be to decode and playback. In this case, faster hardware will help you.
There are also many flavors of h.265 and various pieces of hardware have only supported accelerating parts of the codec. Actually to my knowledge there isn't any graphics card or processor that supports acceleration of decoding every aspect of h.265. h.265 even has a 12-bit specification and a RAW specification and I know of nothing that supports acceleration either in decode or encode. Anyway, that's a tangent, the point is some cards/cpus only support 8-bit codecs or only 420. They may have a harder time with long-GOP decoding. Etc. So look at what it is you're having trouble with playing back, it may be more than just a resolution issue. It may really be a codec one.
Click to expand...
I believe starting with the RTX 3000 series, Nvidia supports hardware acceleration on the gpu for decoding using AV1.

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/gfecnt/202009/rtx-30-series-av1-decoding/
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
Yeahhhh because of everything I've read here, I'm starting to think I simply have been dealing with 24fps content... and not some hardware limitation... Also, my current TV is so old that the built in prime/netflix apps are so slow to use that I just use prime/netflix in a browser via the media server, and I've read there are limitations with video playback from a browser compared to an app built into the TV.
Alright thanks [H], so I probably don't need to upgrade my GPU, I simply just need a newer TV that has the ability to smooth out 24fps content, and has faster built in apps, something the A95L should help with.
Click to expand...
A brand new tv will also increase your visual enjoyment as well as typically ship with more advanced processors that hopefully will help fix your playback judder issues.

Are you stepping up to a new OLED panel as well? To give you more headaches to ponder there are different types of OLED technology depending on what company you pick - W-OLED and QD-OLED.
 
LukeTbk said:
Do you have a source or it is something you track vram usage during playback ?

Lot of 2GB of total ram device play 4k content quite well. Usually online we will see that you need 6GB or 8GB for 4K movie editing, not simple playback.
Click to expand...
You're probably right that there exist lower ram equipped playback cards that can do the job of playing back 4k. I'm probably thinking of rendering 4k in regards to using up the full 8GB memory.

I simply suggested the model that had the most features and I'm pretty sure will do the job.

12GB is super future proof and it's a low profile model suitable for HTPC application.

It might be overkill if he doesn't do any video encoding though as others have discussed.

One thing to note is that some older video cards don't have an HDMI 2.1 port with the bandwidth to properly do 4k@120hz so that is something to watch out for.
 
Koldur said:
A lot of people say that high framerate (HFR) video is more natural than 24fps, but that isn't the case either. Turn your head quickly and see how you perceive that, not smooth at all, so HFR isn't natural at all (though what one likes better than someone else, is completely personal).
Click to expand...
sit on a chair that rotates, put your finger in front of your face and look at your finger as you turn left and right, the background will be smooth.
 
vjhawk said:
You're probably right that there exist lower ram equipped playback cards that can do the job of playing back 4k. I'm probably thinking of rendering 4k in regards to using up the full 8GB memory.

I simply suggested the model that had the most features and I'm pretty sure will do the job.

12GB is super future proof and it's a low profile model suitable for HTPC application.

It might be overkill if he doesn't do any video encoding though as others have discussed.

One thing to note is that some older video cards don't have an HDMI 2.1 port with the bandwidth to properly do 4k@120hz so that is something to watch out for.
Click to expand...
1701810809963.png

This is 3GB of shared ram for the system as well as the GPU.
 
vjhawk said:
I believe starting with the RTX 3000 series, Nvidia supports hardware acceleration on the gpu for decoding using AV1.

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/gfecnt/202009/rtx-30-series-av1-decoding/
Click to expand...
That's great, but it's only relevant if everything the OP is trying to decode is AV1. That was my point. There are numerous codecs that all benefit from having specialized decoding support, and even inside of those codecs different levels of support can be given.

Something like ProRes will playback easily on nearly every device because it has so little compression. But a lot of these h.265 variations are 10-bit, 422, long-GOP, and squeeze the heck out of them utilizing every compression option h.265 has to offer. And those particular encoding variations may not be supported in hardware decoding in whatever is being used.
 
Zepher said:
sit on a chair that rotates, put your finger in front of your face and look at your finger as you turn left and right, the background will be smooth.
Click to expand...
I don't know how you move around in the world, but I do not do it sitting on a chair looking at my finger :p

I actually tried it, but it didn't give me the same result is HFR in videos does, not close at all. The biggest issue there, is that movies are displayed on a static screen and your head doesn't move at all, so the experience is never like you will in real life.
Again, if you like HFR more, use it and turn on the interpolation techniques, nowadays those techniques do not introduce the many artifacts they did in the past.

The good thing about these things is, there is choice, choose what you like, but it will always be unnatural, unless movies will be made full 360 for VR/MR headsets and you move your head around yourself.
Even then there will be some small degree of being not a 100% natural, but that will be technobabble if you ask me. I play games in VR a lot and even with 90Hz it feels so close to real in the respect of moving around, that it is more than close enough.
 
LukeTbk said:
I could imagine that (it has to handle the different input and output data, the conversion step-code all at the same time, have more buffer), but the op seem to be plugging the computer directly to the tv (which I imagine can be ok with just 2-3 frame in memory at the same time), not a plexserver type situation
Click to expand...
Correct, I'm just plugging my tv directly into my media server, when I turn my TV I see the windows desktop, no frontend like plex.
vjhawk said:
I believe starting with the RTX 3000 series, Nvidia supports hardware acceleration on the gpu for decoding using AV1.

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/gfecnt/202009/rtx-30-series-av1-decoding/
Click to expand...
Thats what I was thinking of, but I guess it's really only for AV1, a format I rarely use.
vjhawk said:
A brand new tv will also increase your visual enjoyment as well as typically ship with more advanced processors that hopefully will help fix your playback judder issues.

Are you stepping up to a new OLED panel as well? To give you more headaches to ponder there are different types of OLED technology depending on what company you pick - W-OLED and QD-OLED.
Click to expand...
I have done lots of homework on what TV I want, I'm pretty locked into qd-oled. And the A95L as apparently it does better motion smoothing than the S95C. Also I really don't want that one connect box found on the S95C.
pendragon1 said:
you guys are over-complicating and over-thinking this and probably confusing the fuck out of the op...

https://www.winxdvd.com/convert-4k-video/best-video-card-for-4k-movies-playback-on-pc.htm
min for h264: 4th gen intel igpu, nvidia 650 or newer, amd hd 7000 or newer
min for hevc/265(4:4:4): nv 1030, amd rx400, intel skylake+

ps: op never mentioned av1....
which is rx 6000, nv 4000+
Click to expand...
haha all good, I got the idea, its probably a 24fps issue.
Last night I tried watching video content on my media server (1050ti), and my gaming system (6800xt) that actually each use the same TV as a monitor (sony x800E) and each system had jutter when watching the same content.
I just never noticed on my gaming PC because I don't really watch videos on it, only game at 60fps.

Thanks all, I will start saving all my pennies for a new TV that has good motion smoothing, and maybe a low powered GPU that has hdmi 2.1...
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
Correct, I'm just plugging my tv directly into my media server, when I turn my TV I see the windows desktop, no frontend like plex.

Thats what I was thinking of, but I guess it's really only for AV1, a format I rarely use.

I have done lots of homework on what TV I want, I'm pretty locked into qd-oled. And the A95L as apparently it does better motion smoothing than the S95C. Also I really don't want that one connect box found on the S95C.

haha all good, I got the idea, its probably a 24fps issue.
Last night I tried watching video content on my media server (1050ti), and my gaming system (6800xt) that actually each use the same TV as a monitor (sony x800E) and each system had jutter when watching the same content.
I just never noticed on my gaming PC because I don't really watch videos on it, only game at 60fps.

Thanks all, I will start saving all my pennies for a new TV that has good motion smoothing, and maybe a low powered GPU that has hdmi 2.1...
Click to expand...
you current tv will probably do 24fps, if you set your player to output at it. even dropping to it in windows display settings would be enough to test.
 
djstarfox said:
I just played a 4K movie on my AMD 6800.... uses about 1% CPU and 7% GPU. No studder here. Monitor refresh rate is 120Hz however, which I've found to be helpful all around.
Click to expand...
Yeah, it should at least do smooth video playback despite being AMD - Nvidia might have more features or support but for basic video playback using a 4k TV @ 60 hz - it should work. He probably has an issue with his setup - I doubt it's the gpu.
 
pendragon1 said:
you current tv will probably do 24fps, if you set your player to output at it. even dropping to it in windows display settings would be enough to test.
Click to expand...
when you say my player, do you mean like VLC?
pavel said:
Yeah, it should at least do smooth video playback despite being AMD - Nvidia might have more features or support but for basic video playback using a 4k TV @ 60 hz - it should work. He probably has an issue with his setup - I doubt it's the gpu.
Click to expand...
uahhh, I didn't even think of seeing if there is a smoothness option within the NV display settings, good call, I will test that tonight. .
 
Gatecrasher3000 said:
when you say my player, do you mean like VLC?

uahhh, I didn't even think of seeing if there is a smoothness option within the NV display settings, good call, I will test that tonight. .
Click to expand...
i dont know if/how to do it in VLC, i dont see an option for it but im on my work macbook....
you could give media player classic a try. i get it with the klite codec pack(inc. in standard to mega installs)
on this screen you change the display mode to match the files fps(tick the autochange box)
1701878762242.png
 
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