Uber Still Hates Blind People

[HardOCP News]

Uber sure seems to like bad press. The ride-sharing company is back in the news for hating on blind people and their service dogs. I would be more likely to give Uber a pass had this been an isolated incident but how many times has this happened now?

According to an Orange County Sheriff’s Office arrest report cited by the Orlando Sentinel, an Uber driver hit a blind man standing in the door frame of his van, and laughed when deputies arrested him for refusing to take the man’s service dog. Police said the Uber driver laughed during his arrest, as if he “didn’t fully understand that he had broken the law.”

 

[amddragonpc]

Uber should program their app to indicate drivers that would transport service animals.

 

[DocSavage]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

 

[oROEchimaru]

Most service dogs are extremely well trained to the point your average dog is not even the same species. It is a requirement with rigorous testing except in cases where people may have their "comfort" pet which is not trained. However real service animals for the blind, disabled etc are some of the best dogs you would ever meet.
a. they cant/are not allowed to jump on stuff/lap/kids
b. they cant have accidents (bathroom)
c. have to be mellow/cannot bark etc

In most cases its kind of amazing how quiet they are.

 

[Grahamkracka]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

There is a world of difference between a REAL service animal (for the blind, etc) vs the bullshit ones you see people bring around. In the unlikely event that the service animal causes damage YOU DO have a right to recoup damage costs.

 

[modi123]

Pfffsst.. my Anxiety Turkey and Anxiety Pig are my social support animals! They are my best friends; even when flying! Certainly when dialing up an uber.

Flight attendant takes photo of TURKEY passenger brought on plane
Passenger asked to deplane after her emotional support pig became disruptive • /r/pics

 

[P4B]

them guys have to have new cars in order to get the job. one dog can poop or trash that in a sec

 

[Quix]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

Get a dog cage.

 

[dandirk]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

Well lets all be glad working for Uber is optional for you then.

 

[Xrave]

Need to differentiate service dog vs. support animal.

Service dogs are what you see leading the blind. These are highly trained since birth/obedient dogs.

Support animals are the bullshit excuse people use to take their pets on flights for free, into places where pets aren't allowed, etc.

That being said, the Uber passenger in the article actually did have a real service dog.

 

[sfsuphysics]

Not trying to be funny, but how does a blind person use an uber app? are there braille versions of smartphones or something?

(and yes I'm aware that someone else could have done the whole uber thing)

That said a sign "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" is just a sign, it has no legal merit

 

[Xrave]

Not trying to be funny, but how does a blind person use an uber app? are there braille versions of smartphones or something?

iPhone has an option to enable voice readouts of different programs that support it, and I do know you can buy a braille screen add-on to iPhones (my cowork's wife is blind, she uses one). It costs >$1k...but it's available.

 

[evilsofa]

Not trying to be funny, but how does a blind person use an uber app? are there braille versions of smartphones or something?

The iPhone in particular caters to the blind and low vision, like all Apple products do, right from the very beginning. Steve Jobs has gotten a lot of criticism for apparently never being philanthropic, but one of the few philanthropic things we do know about is his significant donation to the Seva Foundation (source, source) in 1980.

Smartphone apps can be set up with all the voice command stuff, and swiping is as easy for blind people as it is for sighted - I've heard blind people scrolling through lists of their contacts, the phone's voice rapidly stuttering through the first syllables of the contact names.

By far the slickest setup I've seen for a fully deaf and blind person was that he simply handed me a smartphone (I didn't notice a brand on it anywhere) set up to only allow you to communicate by text message to a specific source. He then typed on his Braille machine, the text popped up on the device, I texted him back and the Braille machine "printed" the answer for him.

A couple of years ago there was a company that was making smartphone screens with 3D buttons that would physically raise up out of the screen. I am trying to remember if we saw the news here about it being bought (by Apple?) but I cannot remember its name now. I've been wondering if we would see that start to appear in smartphones but haven't seen a thing about it since.

 

[shspvr]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

What the hell is your problem
Don't you know anything there is a world of difference between a service animal vs reg run of mill animal

 

[Kaitian]

I'd be kind of pissed having someone just put their service dog in my car unless fairly compensated for any damage. Though a van should have enough floor space to not be a problem.

Well I'm sure you can tell the difference between a blind person with a eye-seeing dog and those who have comfort dogs.

 

[Arcygenical]

I'm horribly allergic to dogs... And most other animals, for that matter. Bring on the service birds, though.

This should be entirely optional to Uber drivers, TBH. Their car, their rules. They're not employees, they're subcontracted.

Sorry blind people, but my health issues are a concern as well.

 

[Kaitian]

I'm horribly allergic to dogs... And most other animals, for that matter. Bring on the service birds, though.

This should be entirely optional to Uber drivers, TBH. Their car, their rules. They're not employees, they're subcontracted.

Sorry blind people, but my health issues are a concern as well.

There's a difference. Your allergy can be mitigated. Blindness on the other hand isn't possible to mitigate. They didn't have the choice to become blind and have to rely on accommodations such as service dogs that are trained. It's still the law they have to comply with which they are a public service. If they don't want to abide by the rules, these contractors can go private and only drive exclusive people.

 

[DrLobotomy]

I think everyone should just take their dog with them on uber. Then maybe they will get the message.

 

[[Spectre]]

Most service dogs are extremely well trained to the point your average dog is not even the same species. It is a requirement with rigorous testing except in cases where people may have their "comfort" pet which is not trained. However real service animals for the blind, disabled etc are some of the best dogs you would ever meet.
a. they cant/are not allowed to jump on stuff/lap/kids
b. they cant have accidents (bathroom)
c. have to be mellow/cannot bark etc

In most cases its kind of amazing how quiet they are.

True service dogs are indeed amazingly well behaved and trained. I fly enough with them and I am always amazed that they are so well behaved because that has to be the worst environment for them. Now, on other end of the spectrum are the "emotional support" animals. That shit is ridiculous, so many problems with them and their owners. I'm really not sure which is worse, emotional support/comfort animals or their owners.

 

[Arcygenical]

There's a difference. Your allergy can be mitigated. Blindness on the other hand isn't possible to mitigate. They didn't have the choice to become blind and have to rely on accommodations such as service dogs that are trained. It's still the law they have to comply with which they are a public service. If they don't want to abide by the rules, these contractors can go private and only drive exclusive people.

Well, not in my private vehicle. Allergies cannot be mitigated without medications, and as an asthmatic allergy sufferer, it actually can cause some serious problems for me.

Granted, MOST of this would be mitigated by some serious 2 way communication between drivers and passengers. I'm sure most service animal owners would be understanding, and I'd likely go out of my way to provide an alternate accommodation (like contacting dispatch). But,
you're correct, it's the law. I think it's a bad law, and it's another reason I would never work for Uber (or any other "service" wrangled by stupid ADA laws).

 

[Kaitian]

Well, not in my private vehicle. Allergies cannot be mitigated without medications, and as an asthmatic allergy sufferer, it actually can cause some serious problems for me.

Granted, MOST of this would be mitigated by some serious 2 way communication between drivers and passengers. I'm sure most service animal owners would be understanding, and I'd likely go out of my way to provide an alternate accommodation (like contacting dispatch). But,
you're correct, it's the law. I think it's a bad law, and it's another reason I would never work for Uber (or any other "service" wrangled by stupid ADA laws).

You just contradicted yourself. You already stated that allergies can be mitigated as was my point. Tell me a drug that mitigates blindness.

Now, you have a private vehicle but the moment you choose to engage in a PUBLIC SERVICE like Uber, you have to follow the law.

 

[Arcygenical]

Meh, the law is stupid. Fuck the blind.

 

[[Spectre]]

You just contradicted yourself. You already stated that allergies can be mitigated as was my point. Tell me a drug that mitigates blindness.

Now, you have a private vehicle but the moment you choose to engage in a PUBLIC SERVICE like Uber, you have to follow the law.

Is Uber a public service? I thought Uber said it was supposed to be a ride sharing service not a for hire/livery company and shouldn't be subject to regulation.

 

[Kaitian]

Is Uber a public service? I thought Uber said it was supposed to be a ride sharing service not a for hire/livery company and shouldn't be subject to regulation.

Yes, it is a public service or "public accommodations" is the term to use. I'm not talking government entities here. The fact remains is that if Uber advertises themselves as a service to the public, they become subjected to the laws on the book regarding who they serve without running afoul of discrimination laws. For example, a public storefront cannot deny black people from shopping there even though the store owner's rationale may be that black people steal more than other races do.

 

[[Spectre]]

Yes, it is a public service or "public accommodations" is the term to use. I'm not talking government entities here. The fact remains is that if Uber advertises themselves as a service to the public, they become subjected to the laws on the book regarding who they serve without running afoul of discrimination laws. For example, a public storefront cannot deny black people from shopping there even though the store owner's rationale may be that black people steal more than other races do.

No, that is not true. Private organizations and services can advertise themselves in a number of ways and Uber has made it clear that standard for hire/livery regulations do not apply to them because they are a ride sharing service not a for hire/livery company. If standard for hire/livery regulations do not apply then they are not a common carrier and are not bound by any such regulations as an individual sharing their vehicle or ride can transport whoever they like for whatever reason they like.

 

[Kaitian]

No, that is not true. Private organizations and services can advertise themselves in a number of ways and Uber has made it clear that standard for hire/livery regulations do not apply to them because they are a ride sharing service not a for hire/livery company. If standard for hire/livery regulations do not apply then they are not a common carrier and are not bound by any such regulations as an individual sharing their vehicle or ride can transport whoever they like for whatever reason they like.

But they cannot say "Blind People with Service Dogs Need Not Apply" because the ADA overrides it automatically and cannot make their decisions on the basis of disabilities or their needs. They are a public accommodation service that must comply with federal law. As this article already shows, the driver broke the law. Uber already states that they will comply with disability laws governing blind people with dogs so their drivers have to comply or be shown the door.

The company will also use stricter enforcement in cases where drivers fail to comply: it’ll only take a single complaint now to have a driver removed from the platform if Uber finds that the driver knowingly denied a rider with a service animal. If a driver has more than one such complaint leveled at them, they’ll be booted from the platform regardless of the driver’s intent.

 

[[Spectre]]

But they cannot say "Blind People with Service Dogs Need Not Apply" because the ADA overrides it automatically and cannot make their decisions on the basis of disabilities or their needs. They are a public accommodation service that must comply with federal law. As this article already shows, the driver broke the law. Uber already states that they will comply with disability laws governing blind people with dogs so their drivers have to comply or be shown the door.

So, what you are saying is that when it comes to licensing/screening/compliance with their drivers in municipalities Uber is lying about regulations for for hire/livery services applying to them because they are not a ride sharing service but a livery company?

 

[Wrecked Em]

Trained service dog or not, it still smells and sheds. I put my English Lab (a common service breed) in one of my nice cars once, and it took me over 30 min to get the hair out of the carpet.

Imagine if you were the next passenger, and dressed nice for some event. Hope you brought a lint brush.

If I were the Uber driver and saw a dog, I would just pretend I couldn't locate the passenger.

 

[Kaitian]

Trained service dog or not, it still smells and sheds. I put my English Lab (a common service breed) in one of my nice cars once, and it took me over 30 min to get the hair out of the carpet.

Imagine if you were the next passenger, and dressed nice for some event. Hope you brought a lint brush.

If I were the Uber driver and saw a dog, I would just pretend I couldn't locate the passenger.

Uber will investigate if that specific user file a complaint and see if there's a pattern with this specific user. If they find there is a pattern, they will ban the driver(s) from working for Uber ever again.

 

[DocSavage]

What the hell is your problem
Don't you know anything there is a world of difference between a service animal vs reg run of mill animal

Damn, you guys are harsh. I didn't say I'd do like the guy in the article! It is nice to see this many people defending blind people - who obviously have a shitty enough time even without having to deal with assholes.

 

[hexamon]

I just want to talk about how amazing service dogs are. I commute daily on rush hour trains in Tokyo. Imagine if you took the first 4 rows of people in the pit at a concert and teleport-ed them into a train car, that's how crammed it often is. Anyway at one stop after a bunch of people got off the train a blind woman and her service dog got on. There is reserved seats for people with special needs, so someone got up so she could have a seat. The thing is all that space in front of the seats is still going to be completely packed with people. I was pretty concerned for the dog. I didn't need to be, the lady sat down and the dog lays at her feet, she then put her feet on the dog like it was a foot-stool and proceeds to use her legs to slide it under the bench. The whole time the dog was calm as fuck and was giving off the vibe of, "what, this is what I do." By this time the train car has filled with people again . For the next 20 minutes I watched the dog deal with a situation that honestly makes me wonder if I am going to loose it at times, with complete calmness.

 

[Hagrid]

I think it should have an option like some have said for any kind of animal. I would not want one in a new car. All that dam hair everywhere. Also somebody stated they are allergic. You have to take that into consideration when you are picking up other people. If people don't like it, then choose a different company.

 

[copy_run_start]

I think it should have an option like some have said for any kind of animal. I would not want one in a new car. All that dam hair everywhere. Also somebody stated they are allergic. You have to take that into consideration when you are picking up other people. If people don't like it, then choose a different company.

Lucky for disabled people, there are these silly things called laws that make what you're talking about illegal.

 

[sfsuphysics]

Meh, the law is stupid. Fuck the blind.

Damn straight! All those annoying fucking yellow bumps put on every corner at the tax payers expense! Oh and in like every god damn story in the state too which makes your shopping cart bounce around like a speed freak having an epileptic seizure when you roll over it and you HAVE to roll over, I mean it's to tell you you're going into the "roadway" of a PARKING LOT, blind people really shouldn't be driving, and if they're with a friend the friend should be the one helping them out if they walk into traffic! I mean christ my baby's cheeks jiggle so adorably when I go over them in the cart, but damnit if it doesn't shake out half of the shit in my bags.

Down with the blind and their iron grip on this country!!!!

 

[sfsuphysics]

Now, you have a private vehicle but the moment you choose to engage in a PUBLIC SERVICE like Uber, you have to follow the law.

Interesting take on public service though, it's a private agreement between two individuals using a third party as a mediary. I mean it's not like a mass transit service, or hell even a taxi service which does get special exemptions from local governments.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

What are drivers who are allergic to dogs supposed to do?

It's not as if a dog is hypoallergenic just because it is a seeing eye dog...

Does this mean that in jurisdictions with this law, allergic people simply can't be drivers?

 

[Kaitian]

What are drivers who are allergic to dogs supposed to do?

It's not as if a dog is hypoallergenic just because it is a seeing eye dog...

Does this mean that in jurisdictions with this law, allergic people simply can't be drivers?

Call your employer and let them know that you are allergic to dogs? Wow, communication, it's such a marvel concept that makes it necessary to communicate with your employer.