So is all this madness still in full swing?

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I got super lucky and found a 3070 Ti for retail pricing. I did have to buy a PSU with it though. I saw they were only selling in person, and I called to hold one for me and they couldn't.. They had 7 in stock during the call, and an hour later when I got there they were down to two.. and I got one! Lol.. it took 9 months to finish my build.

Edit:

Was about $350 cheaper than a 6700XT sold by Newegg.ca, not their third party sellers either.. they are fucking scalpers too.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
Not really. They're talking about gamers there who mine on the side. Which describes a fair few of them these days. Or are they now Satan himself too just like the filthy gdamned miners?
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I just highly doubt it. I know lots of people who are gamers and haven't been able to buy a card for months, me included. I only just recently got one through the EVGA queue.
 
Cards have been available for months just not at the prices you and some others are willing to pay for it.
 
Why does it matter who is paying them? Reality is, miners and gamers both sometimes pay scalper prices. Because they can.
 
Furious_Styles said:
Because it certainly seems like one group is very willing to pay those prices and one isn't.
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What little information we do have is that 75% of them went to gamers and 25% to miners. Based on that, one group most certainly was very willing to pay those prices. But it may not be the group you were expecting.

As for me anyway, I don't really care. If you have the means and want one then go get it. It's out there to be had. If you don't want to spend the money or just flat don't have it, then I'm sorry to hear that.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
What little information we do have is that 75% of them went to gamers and 25% to miners. Based on that, one group most certainly was very willing to pay those prices. But it may not be the group you were expecting.

As for me anyway, I don't really care. If you have the means and want one then go get it. It's out there to be had. If you don't want to spend the money or just flat don't have it, then I'm sorry to hear that.
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You live on this earth c'mon man. If only 25% of cards are going to miners then why has everything been OOS since release for just about all cards? I've been in almost every newegg shuffle and only been selected once and passed because I won a crappy bundle with an AMD card. Either that "casual miner" accounts for way more than just gamers with 1 card who are mining or something is really odd about those numbers.
 
peppergomez said:
If this continues for another few years I could see PC gaming becoming a niche hobby only or mostly for the wealthy. that would affect game development eventually.
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Tin foil hat time. What if this is intentional global gouging to make people pay for more tech just because they can and people will pay for it? Seriously, I'm hoping my GPU, car and other tech I have doesn't break so I don't have to overpay for new tech to replace them.
 
Furious_Styles said:
You live on this earth c'mon man. If only 25% of cards are going to miners then why has everything been OOS since release for just about all cards?
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If you think more than 25% are going to miners then it's on you to prove it. Otherwise, speculatory. If you can, then great, I still don't really care (much) if they are. The cards are available and have been, they are expensive.

They've been OOS since release due to supply not being able to keep up with demand. All sorts of reasons for that. Someone showed earlier that shipments are less than what we have seen in the past too. They just flat aren't producing devices fast enough to keep up with demand.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
If you think more than 25% are going to miners then it's on you to prove it. Otherwise, speculatory. If you can, then great, I still don't really care (much) if they are. The cards are available and have been, they are expensive.

They've been OOS since release due to supply not being able to keep up with demand. All sorts of reasons for that. Someone showed earlier that shipments are less than what we have seen in the past too. They just flat aren't producing devices fast enough to keep up with demand.
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Okay. I won't bother trying if you don't care.
 
Furious_Styles said:
You live on this earth c'mon man. If only 25% of cards are going to miners then why has everything been OOS since release for just about all cards? I've been in almost every newegg shuffle and only been selected once and passed because I won a crappy bundle with an AMD card. Either that "casual miner" accounts for way more than just gamers with 1 card who are mining or something is really odd about those numbers.
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Many of us bought more than one - I got 2 6800XT, a 3090, a 3080, and a 3070 - all for different uses (Was time to upgrade and build, and with stay at home last year - well, I built a LOT of shit). There are also a lot of folks buying htem to scalp, which reduces the number available at MSRP - that was income when a lot of jobs were closed, and fuck it - why not (from their perspective). Plus mining. Plus industry wide shipping issues. Plus a LOT of things building on TSMC 7nm and samsung 8nm.
 
lopoetve said:
Many of us bought more than one - I got 2 6800XT, a 3090, a 3080, and a 3070 - all for different uses (Was time to upgrade and build, and with stay at home last year - well, I built a LOT of shit). There are also a lot of folks buying htem to scalp, which reduces the number available at MSRP - that was income when a lot of jobs were closed, and fuck it - why not (from their perspective). Plus mining. Plus industry wide shipping issues. Plus a LOT of things building on TSMC 7nm and samsung 8nm.
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Exactly, the typical gamer wants one card, not 5. You are not in that group clearly.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
Some would say it's already a niche hobby and has always been so to one degree or another. Going off past history the shortage will subside eventually one way or another. If that's wrong and it's permanent it is hard to know for sure what the effect would be long term. There are some people who have the disposable income to buy a scalped graphics card and would continue to pay that pricing because they enjoy the hobby that much.

Gamers get the majority of graphics cards produced not miners. It seems evident to me at this point that regardless of the merits or lack thereof for the justification, the entitlement mentality does exist with gamers. Many of them do feel they are owed a card and for the price they feel is justifiable. I don't personally approve of that but at this point it doesn't really matter what anyone's feelings are here.

The situation is beyond our control and simply IS.
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I guess I don't agree about gamer's being entitled. It's more like, there has been a more or less supply and demand balance for many product generations now. I'ts a hobby from which lots of guys enjoy themselves. Thats no different from any other hobby. Then out of nowhere come these miners who have an insatiable demand for GPUs. And they have a financial incentive to do so, unlike gamers. (I'm excluding professional competitive gamers). So these miners have basically wrecked the supply and demand balance, and caused prices to rise 2x. 3X and even more.

Now tell me why gamers should not be resentful and angry, very angry.
 
Furious_Styles said:
Exactly, the typical gamer wants one card, not 5. You are not in that group clearly.
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That fits in the numbers though - I'm not mining on any of them, they're for gaming and workstation use, and were bought by a gamer (not a miner) - I fit into the 75%, even though I'm an outlier if you want to break down that 75% to more detailed numbers.
 
peppergomez said:
If this continues for another few years I could see PC gaming becoming a niche hobby only or mostly for the wealthy. that would affect game development eventually.
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Nvidia sell their GPUs based on MH/s now, IMO.
I don't see how gamers can justify paying that amount of money and not mine.

I've never mined but I started yesterday after I bought my first 1K+ GPU. At this point, I need ROI for any GPU purchase.
So gamers should buy shares of Nvidia, Intel and AMD, and mine on the side to continue the hobby with affordability.
 
Saabjock said:
What'd make you believe that?
How many consoles do you believe are made compared to graphics cards?
I can tell you...a whole lot less.
If a PC gamer cannot get the components to build his/her gaming rig, what is the next best option for those who aren't hard-core PC?....Answer: console. Hence the shortage.
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Make me believe what ?

Discrete graphics cards vs consoles ?

mQEMTcchoGh5XXcc3yp6ag-1280-80.png


Console:
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A good quarter (christmas one) even with very old consoles they could go above 19 millions units, a strong GPU is around 11-12 million units
revealed that the company had shipped 4.5 million PS5 units worldwide through the end of 2020.
 
rolling_tiger said:
We aren't arguing about the same thing. I'm arguing miners affected the entire GPU market, new and used. They don't just need one GPU, they need all available GPUs to increase the amount of money they make each day. It's insatiable demand.

The PS5s are scarce because the market demand is about 100M units for the entire console's retail life and there have only been about 10M to 15M made so far. You can still go out and buy the previous model for less than MSRP.

Shortages in all industries are real. No one is disputing that. Bottom line: miners screwed the current GPU market as they did at the end of 2017 and into 2018 before COVID-19 and chip shortages were a thing.
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That trivially true, no one is arguing that the miners does not have a big impact of all minable gpus price and availibility, the debate was if it was the single factor going on.

No one is disputing that.

Yes that the very thing that someone disputed and that people was disagreeing with, people are arguing that unlike the 2017-2018 crisis (high price but you could still buy GPUs), this one has more factor into it, one of them being that unlike 2017-2018 when Gpus production jumped higher to match demand, we do see it this time, production being above 2019 but far from 2017-2018, speculating why (a factor would be the giant demand for computer discrete Gpus like hardware).
 
philb2 said:
I guess I don't agree about gamer's being entitled. It's more like, there has been a more or less supply and demand balance for many product generations now. I'ts a hobby from which lots of guys enjoy themselves. Thats no different from any other hobby. Then out of nowhere come these miners who have an insatiable demand for GPUs. And they have a financial incentive to do so, unlike gamers. (I'm excluding professional competitive gamers). So these miners have basically wrecked the supply and demand balance, and caused prices to rise 2x. 3X and even more.

Now tell me why gamers should not be resentful and angry, very angry.
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We'll have to agree to disagree on this I guess.

Lots of sour grapes.
 
LukeTbk said:
That trivially true, no one is arguing that the miners does not have a big impact of all minable gpus price and availibility, the debate was if it was the single factor going on.

No one is disputing that.

Yes that the very thing that someone disputed and that people was disagreeing with, people are arguing that unlike the 2017-2018 crisis (high price but you could still buy GPUs), this one has more factor into it, one of them being that unlike 2017-2018 when Gpus production jumped higher to match demand, we do see it this time, production being above 2019 but far from 2017-2018, speculating why (a factor would be the giant demand for computer discrete Gpus like hardware).
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We definitely aren't arguing about the same thing. Miners pushed demand of New and used GPUs beyond supply. Once that happens, the whole market is fucked.

If demand was 99% of available supply, GPUs would not double in price or more. If demand is 110% of supply, that's when the market get fucked.

If it was a normal GPU launch cycle, without mining, the market would more closely follow what's happening with Zen 3 processors, even with the global pandemic and everything else happening at this time.
 
rolling_tiger said:
We definitely aren't arguing about the same thing. Miners pushed demand of New and used GPUs beyond supply. Once that happens, the whole market is fucked.

If demand was 99% of available supply, GPUs would not double in price or more. If demand is 110% of supply, that's when the market get fucked.

If it was a normal GPU launch cycle, without mining, the market would more closely follow what's happening with Zen 3 processors, even with the global pandemic and everything else happening at this time.
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People can discuss all day and into the night about all the different factors affecting the GPU shortage. But I hope there is agreement that the numero uno factor is professional miners, along with their pilot fish scalpers.They should both rot in hell and their wives should all dump them.
 
philb2 said:
People can discuss all day and into the night about all the different factors affecting the GPU shortage. But I hope there is agreement that the numero uno factor is professional miners, along with their pilot fish scalpers.They should both rot in hell and their wives should all dump them.
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Trying to bring this thread to a close so you can make another one? I'm pretty sure this is your third thread you created with effectively the same topic worded slightly differently.
 
philb2 said:
People can discuss all day and into the night about all the different factors affecting the GPU shortage. But I hope there is agreement that the numero uno factor is professional miners, along with their pilot fish scalpers.They should both rot in hell and their wives should all dump them.
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Unfortunately most wives aren't intelligent enough to even know what GPU mining is.
 
philb2 said:
But I hope there is agreement that the numero uno factor is professional miners, along with their pilot fish scalpers.
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No sir, there is not universal agreement even around these parts. Keep hoping.

lol rotting in hell and wives divorcing them sounds like you're pretty upset. Might be time to take a breather.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
No sir, there is not universal agreement even around these parts. Keep hoping.

lol rotting in hell and wives divorcing them sounds like you're pretty upset. Might be time to take a breather.
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lol. Miners and flippers aren't even close to being the problem. The problem is Nvidia helping the miners, flippers and prioritizing business contracts.
Games are nowhere on Nvidia's radar, the stock price is. For pure gamers, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.
 
Riptide_NVN said:
No sir, there is not universal agreement even around these parts. Keep hoping.

lol rotting in hell and wives divorcing them sounds like you're pretty upset. Might be time to take a breather.
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Riptide_NVN Yes I am pretty pissed. I've been trying to get a 3060 ti (or maybe a 3070) for most of a year now. But I can't explain $1000 (or a lot more) to my wife. Back in May 2020, I did a new board, CPU and RAM for about $1200 and I told my wife that I was going to wait for a latest-generation vid card due in September or October, for which I said I would need to spend $400 or maybe a bit more. Good luck with that. Waiting overnight at a BB is not possible for me. And I've wasted too much time already with the notification bots.

Well, I blow off steam reading these threads with all the posts about no one being able to get a card. And I'm learning a lot in the process.
 
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