Preventing Windows from "auto" upgrading to Windows 11

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kindasmart

[H]ard|Gawd
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Edit: Forget to say that pops computer can run Win11.

I've Googled a bit and there are some guides using group policy editor to block Windows upgrading but is there a sure fire way to block the intentional of unintentional actions needed to install of Windows 11?

I don't want my 90 yo pop to click the "upgrade to Windows 11" button! haha.
 
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kindasmart said:
I've Googled a bit and there are some guides using group policy editor to block Windows upgrading but is there a sure fire way to block the intentional of unintentional actions needed to install of Windows 11?

I don't want my 90 yo pop to click the "upgrade to Windows 11" button! haha.
Click to expand...
Answer to 1st question: No, Microsoft disabled that. And to the second one: Do what I did to my parents and in-laws. Set up a linux for them and live without worry of them messing it up with malware and viruses - or unintentional upgrades.
 
kindasmart said:
I've Googled a bit and there are some guides using group policy editor to block Windows upgrading but is there a sure fire way to block the intentional of unintentional actions needed to install of Windows 11?

I don't want my 90 yo pop to click the "upgrade to Windows 11" button! haha.
Click to expand...
is it even being offered on their system? could turn off tpm or secureboot and it shouldnt install. no need to switch oses :rolleyes: ....
 
pendragon1 said:
is it even being offered on their system? could turn off tpm or secureboot and it shouldnt install. no need to switch oses :rolleyes: ....
Click to expand...
Unless the OP wants to keep fixing the malware, pups and viruses on regular basis, OS change is required. Old people are typically the worst, they click on everything. Especially if they use some sort of social media.
 
B00nie said:
Unless the OP wants to keep fixing the malware, pups and viruses on regular basis, OS change is required. Old people are typically the worst, they click on everything. Especially if they use some sort of social media.
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did he ask for your opinion on the os? no. stop trolling windows threads with "switch to linux" bullshit, which you dont even fucking use youself...

op, disabling any of the "needed" security stuff for 11 will prevent the upgrade.
 
B00nie said:
Unless the OP wants to keep fixing the malware, pups and viruses on regular basis, OS change is required. Old people are typically the worst, they click on everything. Especially if they use some sort of social media.
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Agreed. Or a mac is another decent option.
 
B00nie said:
Unless the OP wants to keep fixing the malware, pups and viruses on regular basis, OS change is required. Old people are typically the worst, they click on everything. Especially if they use some sort of social media.
Click to expand...
LOL - I'm 66 1/2 years old, and I don't click on everything, unless you are talking about really old folks > 80 years old. I also have a Linux Mint 20.2 laptop that I have setup myself. I started with version 18, then 19, and now 20. I even got my brother to switch from windows to Linux. I can see why Linux would be an advantage for old folks after using it myself.
 
There is no context in which Windows 11 will automatically install. If you can't stop your father from opening up settings (including Windows Update) and poking around clicking on random stuff, then you have far bigger issues at play. The suggestion to disable TPM would work if you really wanted to prevent it.

Would someone ask how to install a lock on the hood of their father's car so that their father couldn't randomly pop the hood open and start disconnecting things? Or would it be easier to just educate him a bit?

Also, one other question is, why exactly don't you want your father to use Windows 11? For all you know, he might like it better than Windows 10.

B00nie said:
Unless the OP wants to keep fixing the malware, pups and viruses on regular basis, OS change is required. Old people are typically the worst, they click on everything. Especially if they use some sort of social media.
Click to expand...

Security via obscurity only works when you are using an OS with a user-base so small that it's basically irrelevant. Like building a house in Antarctica and then bragging about the low crime rate. We already know that there is nothing inherently secure about Linux itself, and that when there is actually a reason to target it, it's just as susceptible to the real world as Windows is. Android being a Linux OS didn't stop it from becoming flooded with Malware the moment it became popular. Linux servers are infected all the time. No one targets Linux on the desktop because no one uses Linux on the desktop - except those who have had it forced on them by people like you.
 
GotNoRice said:
There is no context in which Windows 11 will automatically install.
Click to expand...

Wasn't there a thing in Win 10 where the "upgrade to Win 10" dialog box popped up and clicking the "red X" started the upgrade? I just want to prevent those type situations. Pops isn't looking to upgrade but he may be "tricked" by some BS pop-up from MS.
 
kindasmart said:
I've Googled a bit and there are some guides using group policy editor to block Windows upgrading but is there a sure fire way to block the intentional of unintentional actions needed to install of Windows 11?

I don't want my 90 yo pop to click the "upgrade to Windows 11" button! haha.
Click to expand...
If your 90yr old pop has a newer PC that can be upgraded to Win11.. let him upgrade? Oh noes, they moved the Start button over a little.
 
SuperSubZero said:
If your 90yr old pop has a newer PC that can be upgraded to Win11.. let him upgrade? Oh noes, they moved the Start button over a little.
Click to expand...
GASP! It also can be moved back! How will pops ever survive?!

I think op is assuming his dad is a moron, which isn't likely true.
 
GotNoRice said:
Security via obscurity only works when you are using an OS with a user-base so small that it's basically irrelevant. Like building a house in Antarctica and then bragging about the low crime rate. We already know that there is nothing inherently secure about Linux itself, and that when there is actually a reason to target it, it's just as susceptible to the real world as Windows is. Android being a Linux OS didn't stop it from becoming flooded with Malware the moment it became popular. Linux servers are infected all the time. No one targets Linux on the desktop because no one uses Linux on the desktop - except those who have had it forced on them by people like you.
Click to expand...
Linux is inherently much safer than Windows. It doesn't run 100 unnecessary processes on the background and users are not administrators by default so no, it's not only about obscurity. But it does help to have only 0,1% of the attacks windows has so it's a no brainer to use it especially when you know the user _will_ click on that malware link when offered.

When my mother was using Windows she averaged 2 weeks before I had to go to clean up her computer. She joins these masss mailing lists where hundreds old women send eachother nice_puppy.AVI.exe files. Or facebook. After I migrated her to linux it's been problem free riding and I only do a major OS upgrade to her once in 1-2 years.
 
GotNoRice said:
Would someone ask how to install a lock on the hood of their father's car so that their father couldn't randomly pop the hood open and start disconnecting things? Or would it be easier to just educate him a bit?
Click to expand...
Depends on the father. My Mother-in-Law would probably do something like click the upgrade button without reading it, not understand how to use her computer after the upgrade, and search in Edge for windows support and call whatever number was there. Even after she's done that before and we told her not to. You can only educate so much when none of it sticks, but you also more or less need the internet to live in society these days, so she gets a Chromebook and I keep my fingers crossed. Had to explain to her multiple times that she needed to log in to the Chromebook (instead of using Guest mode) to use saved passwords and she said she couldn't remember the Chromebook password, but was logged into GMail. (That one was kind of Google's fault though; apparently you can have a Google account with a non-gmail login and a gmail alias and login with either address and then Chrome OS gets really confused; device owner was [email protected], but when you login to either address, it would log you in as gmail and then you couldn't do device owner stuff... had to powerwash it and only login as gmail and it's happy for now)
 
B00nie said:
Linux is inherently much safer than Windows. It doesn't run 100 unnecessary processes on the background and users are not administrators by default so no, it's not only about obscurity. But it does help to have only 0,1% of the attacks windows has so it's a no brainer to use it especially when you know the user _will_ click on that malware link when offered.

When my mother was using Windows she averaged 2 weeks before I had to go to clean up her computer. She joins these masss mailing lists where hundreds old women send eachother nice_puppy.AVI.exe files. Or facebook. After I migrated her to linux it's been problem free riding and I only do a major OS upgrade to her once in 1-2 years.
Click to expand...
Nobody cares or asked about Linux.


M76 said:
You obviously don't know how some older people work. One icon moves a bit on the desktop and they can no longer find it. And they'd blame you "what did you do to my computer?"
Click to expand...
This couldn't be more accurate.
 
B00nie said:
Linux is inherently much safer than Windows. It doesn't run 100 unnecessary processes on the background and users are not administrators by default so no, it's not only about obscurity. But it does help to have only 0,1% of the attacks windows has so it's a no brainer to use it especially when you know the user _will_ click on that malware link when offered.

When my mother was using Windows she averaged 2 weeks before I had to go to clean up her computer. She joins these masss mailing lists where hundreds old women send eachother nice_puppy.AVI.exe files. Or facebook. After I migrated her to linux it's been problem free riding and I only do a major OS upgrade to her once in 1-2 years.
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Stop trolling... No one cares about Linux in this thread.
 
Idk, seems to be suggesting Linux or MacOS is a reasonably relitive to his question.

Windows 11 is not really all that different from 10. In fact, the gui might be better (if configured) for elderly. But if there is concerns with windows 11 and MS forcing it then it sounds like an alternative OS could be in order.

Let’s be honest, Windows is a POS, I wouldn’t run it unless there was a specific need.

Side note, I have moved several family members to Mac, elderly included. 100% have done way better with the OS and had basically zero problems.
 
I'm also going to migrate to Linux as much as possible next build and try get family on it. Win10 has increased the amount of bs I deal with in the family, due to updates breaking things yearly. Had enough! Microsoft, you played yourself.
 
M76 said:
You obviously don't know how some older people work. One icon moves a bit on the desktop and they can no longer find it. And they'd blame you "what did you do to my computer?"
Click to expand...
... and some old people still adjust totally fine to evolving technologies. What's your point?
 
There are some hardware limitations... I believe LGA 1155 and 1st gen Ryzen and older CPUs are unsupported, as is my old Surface. So if Pops has an old enough machine you may be in luck.

The Mac idea is also a good one.
 
SuperSubZero said:
... and some old people still adjust totally fine to evolving technologies. What's your point?
Click to expand...
Most of the elderly are completely technically illiterate. Some will use technology but won't know what they are doing, they just know that clicking somewhere opens facebook. They don't even understand the concept of a web browser, and I have to create separate desktop icons for google and facebook for them.
And then on the margins there are a few who use technology just as any younger person. You simply should not presume anyone will be like this, that was my point.
 
M76 said:
You obviously don't know how some older people work. One icon moves a bit on the desktop and they can no longer find it. And they'd blame you "what did you do to my computer?"
Click to expand...
Fact. My mom is the same way. Nothing I hated more then my mom calling me at 9pm saying her heat isn't working. I asked what did she do and tell me she just changed the batteries in the stat. I ask if she put them in backwards and she swears she did not. i ask her to check and she tells me they in right. I go over there and see no display on the stat and check it and the batteries are in backwards. She constantly has trouble using the streaming box, TV, computer and her android phone.
 
ya just turn off tpm and it won't install. Mine won't go because I'm using legacy bios and tpm is turned off. I like to wait a little bit before upgrading operating systems and let compatibility and drivers settle down. When I'm ready to go and have some free time to tinker, I'll format the drive, turn on uefi and tpm, and I'll do a clean install.

But, I don't know if win11 is a firestorm of issues either - not the end of the world if it installs IMO.
 
M76 said:
Most of the elderly are completely technically illiterate. Some will use technology but won't know what they are doing, they just know that clicking somewhere opens facebook. They don't even understand the concept of a web browser, and I have to create separate desktop icons for google and facebook for them.
And then on the margins there are a few who use technology just as any younger person. You simply should not presume anyone will be like this, that was my point.
Click to expand...
If they are "completely technically illiterate" and concepts like web browsers elude them, why do they have a computer?
 
SuperSubZero said:
If they are "completely technically illiterate" and concepts like web browsers elude them, why do they have a computer?
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Because they need to stay in touch with their grandkids and other family and check their e-mail to get prescription confirmations and other things that require technology now. Otherwise they wouldn't use it. I work with a lot of older folks and they use it because they have to, not because they want to. There is a very very very tiny percentage of them that are actually somewhat proficient at it.
 
Shoganai said:
Because they need to stay in touch with their grandkids and other family and check their e-mail to get prescription confirmations and other things that require technology now. Otherwise they wouldn't use it.
Click to expand...
I'm happy to take M76's statements to the extreme, and assume in his worldview, old people are SO technically inept, SO dysfunctional with ANYTHING involving, say, anything a degree beyond a simple machine (ie. a lever or a pulley) that these people have not *ever* driven a car made after the 1970s, as the technology in a car from 1982 would have completely escaped them. Setting the time on a digital clock is like being dropped into a Salvador Dali painting for these people.

If they are anywhere in the ballpark of this, they aren't doing email or checking prescriptions. They have family doing that for them. However, only a degree or two beyond this there are phones and tablets. I *think* phones and tablets can handle tasks like emails and web pages, and I think many folks who don't necessarily get into tech much can figure them out.
 
As someone that deals with Grandma and Grandpa types, even Mom and Dad types regarding tech issues; they do have an uncanny tendency to click everything presented to them. During the last lockdown, people here were loosing $30k at a time from their bank accounts due to online phishing scams that wouldn't have been possible under Linux. Scammers went on a rampage knowing the state was in lockdown.

The worst thing is: Unless the scammers are actually caught, the banks quite often don't refund the money.

Such people are not suited to Windows, even an iPad would be a better solution for such people.
 
Mazzspeed said:
As someone that deals with Grandma and Grandpa types, even Mom and Dad types regarding tech issues; they do have an uncanny tendency to click everything presented to them. During the last lockdown, people here were loosing $30k at a time from their bank accounts due to online phishing scams that wouldn't have been possible under Linux. Scammers went on a rampage knowing the state was in lockdown.
Click to expand...
I'm curious about how these scams worked. The only time I've seen those rogue "call this Indian call center to fix your Windows" popups is via web browsers. They aren't standalone apps. Web sites with malignant ads in them that throw up a warning. Now, being browser-based, what browsers might these folks be targeting? Chrome maybe? Maybe. Chrome is multi-platform. Firefox? Firefox is multi-platform.

If a malignant ad targets Firefox, there's no guarantee it won't affect Firefox for all 92,856 distros that come with a likely outdated version of Firefox on it. 100% pristinely tech ignorant grandma who is completely incapable of grasping any technology more complicated than a pencil will be fooled by these popups on Linux just as readily as on Windows.
 
SuperSubZero said:
I'm curious about how these scams worked. The only time I've seen those rogue "call this Indian call center to fix your Windows" popups is via web browsers. They aren't standalone apps. Web sites with malignant ads in them that throw up a warning. Now, being browser-based, what browsers might these folks be targeting? Chrome maybe? Maybe. Chrome is multi-platform. Firefox? Firefox is multi-platform.

If a malignant ad targets Firefox, there's no guarantee it won't affect Firefox for all 92,856 distros that come with a likely outdated version of Firefox on it. 100% pristinely tech ignorant grandma who is completely incapable of grasping any technology more complicated than a pencil will be fooled by these popups on Linux just as readily as on Windows.
Click to expand...
I've dealt with a lot of scammers, identity theft, and all kinds of things in my line of work with older folks. One of the most popular methods is that a fake support tech will call them or e-mail them about some awful thing happening to their computer or their bank account and that they're being scammed and it will scare them into contacting support. Once the scammer gets them on the phone, they will then walk them through installing AnyDesk and having them set it up with unattended access, that way the scammer can then wreak havoc whenever they want. In 99% of cases they either have AnyDesk with unattended access or some other screen-sharing app installed like TeamViewer installed with unattended access. I was actually in the middle of diagnosing someone's computer once when the mouse started controlling itself, in which I promptly disconnected network access, backed everything up, and wiped the drive. I then go through the process of having them change all of their passwords and enabling 2FA wherever possible. Someone had identity theft on such a grand scale I had them get a new phone, e-mail, and phone number. This is happening a LOT more lately and the methods aren't even as crazy as you'd think. They are very simple and they aren't necessarily because of clicking a thousand things and getting viruses. They are just very susceptible to these tactics so they're easily exploited. Scammers suck.


Mazzspeed said:
As someone that deals with Grandma and Grandpa types, even Mom and Dad types regarding tech issues; they do have an uncanny tendency to click everything presented to them. During the last lockdown, people here were loosing $30k at a time from their bank accounts due to online phishing scams that wouldn't have been possible under Linux. Scammers went on a rampage knowing the state was in lockdown.

The worst thing is: Unless the scammers are actually caught, the banks quite often don't refund the money.

Such people are not suited to Windows, even an iPad would be a better solution for such people.
Click to expand...
Yes, I've seen people's life savings get wiped out, but their banks were fortunately able to help them. It's getting very very bad.
 
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Shoganai said:
I've dealt with a lot of scammers, identity theft, and all kinds of things in my line of work with older folks. One of the most popular methods is that a fake support tech will call them or e-mail them about some awful thing happening to their computer or their bank account and that they're being scammed and it will scare them into contacting support. Once the scammer gets them on the phone, they will then walk them through installing AnyDesk and having them set it up with unattended access
Click to expand...
That's awful, but that doesn't say anything about the security of Windows. If a scammer is randomly calling phones and gets someone who cooperates with them, the OS they have is irrelevant.

As well, AnyDesk is multiplatform, and any Indian Call Center scammer worth their salt has a multi-pathed checklist for "You have Linux? Of course you do, click this.."
 
SuperSubZero said:
That's awful, but that doesn't say anything about the security of Windows. If a scammer is randomly calling phones and gets someone who cooperates with them, the OS they have is irrelevant.
Click to expand...
The scammers are still gaining remote access to the Windows machine, that's all part of the scam. Under Linux the victim needs to be able to tell the scammers what distro they're running, then they have to be able to install the software via the package manager - The process is a little more involved that just clicking 'yes' at the UAC prompt. The last time I checked, Ubuntu flat out refuses to install any .deb from third party repositories. Furthermore, in nine out of ten cases they get the details of the victim to use as leverage during the scam via previously installed malware.

It's simply to easy to install software under Windows from any obscure corner of the internet. If the scammer has to outline terminal commands to the victim, there's going to be a greater chance of alarm bells going off than there will be if the victim simply has to click 'yes' at a fleeting UAC prompt. At minimum the user should be forced to enter a password to gain privilege escalation.

If the meatbag in front of the machine is the weakness, than you have to sacrifice convenience for even the slightest bit more security. Even Apple are starting to work this out regarding macOS.
 
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SuperSubZero said:
That's awful, but that doesn't say anything about the security of Windows. If a scammer is randomly calling phones and gets someone who cooperates with them, the OS they have is irrelevant.

As well, AnyDesk is multiplatform, and any Indian Call Center scammer worth their salt has a multi-pathed checklist for "You have Linux? Of course you do, click this.."
Click to expand...
The massive amounts of malware from them clicking on and installing literally everything is part of why they were targeted in the first place. Something that is not as prevalent on macOS and Linux.
 
Mazzspeed said:
At minimum the user should be forced to enter a password to gain privilege escalation.
Click to expand...
The user is always the weak link in the chain.
I just checked on Ubuntu and Pop!Os -- downloading AnyDesk is just going to the website and clicking the first big button on the first page to download it. And it installs from that download, no problem. So, the scam works the same there as it does on Windows. Get off your "Linux is more secure" high horse for a second and realize your fanboi blinders are on. B00nie, as well. You both just go into any windows thread and start sending it wildly off topic and it gets really, really, REALLY old.

Can you imagine the shit show and complaints right here on [H[ if MS forced passwords for elevation? Ya'll collectively lost your shit when UAC rolled out.

As for the actual OP's question -- I'd disable TPM in BIOS/UEFI. At present that should cover your bases, though I'd certainly be on the lookout in case the TPM req changes or gets dropped down the line.
 
Eulogy said:
The user is always the weak link in the chain.
I just checked on Ubuntu and Pop!Os -- downloading AnyDesk is just going to the website and clicking the first big button on the first page to download it. And it installs from that download, no problem. So, the scam works the same there as it does on Windows. Get off your "Linux is more secure" high horse for a second and realize your fanboi blinders are on. B00nie, as well. You both just go into any windows thread and start sending it wildly off topic and it gets really, really, REALLY old.

Can you imagine the shit show and complaints right here on [H[ if MS forced passwords for elevation? Ya'll collectively lost your shit when UAC rolled out.

As for the actual OP's question -- I'd disable TPM in BIOS/UEFI. At present that should cover your bases, though I'd certainly be on the lookout in case the TPM req changes or gets dropped down the line.
Click to expand...
You're missing the point.

First of all, the user needs to know that they're running Linux as opposed to Windows, then they have to work out they're running PopOS (the people we're talking about here think Windows is 'the computer'), then they have to know what package manager they're using. Second of all, PopOS isn't the same as Ubuntu. Under 'Ubuntu' (not PopOS), the last time I checked the software center flat out refused to install third party .deb's (ie: Any deb not actually from the Ubuntu Software Center).

Furthermore, under every distro I've used, you have to enter an admin password to install software even when it's packaged as a .deb - It's a small thing, but gives a moments pause from the mind numbing reflex of simply clicking 'Yes' at the UAC prompt - That can mean the difference between a heartbreaking situation and quickly shutting down the PC.

I'm sorry, but out of the box Linux is more secure than Windows. UAC isn't even really an effective privilege escalation tool, it hasn't been since Vista. The idea of security via obscurity is rubbish when you consider that globally Android is the most popular OS and suffers a 'sliver' of the infections targeted at the Windows platform.

Then again, a certain moron YouTube 'tech reviewer' still managed to enter a full sentence and totally hose his whole DE, due to the fact he couldn't read and comprehend a whopping [sarcasm] 14 lines of text warning him of the dangers if he continued and that was after the Pop Shop flat out refused to install the exact same software giving the same verbose 14 line reason why. However...When he switched to Manjaro he was still trying to install software using apt, highlighting my point above re: Package managers.

By the time the scammers have run through all this with the victim, there is a higher chance alarm bells will be going off.

The fact is, conveniant = Less secure. As stated, even Apple have worked this out regarding macOS.
 
Mazzspeed said:
First of all, the user needs to know that they're running Linux as opposed to Windows, then they have to work out they're running PopOS (the people we're talking about here think Windows is 'the computer'), then they have to know what package manager they're using. Second of all, PopOS isn't the same as Ubuntu. Under 'Ubuntu' (not PopOS), the last time I checked the software center flat out refused to install third party .deb's (ie: Any deb not actually from the Ubuntu Software Center).
Click to expand...
No, you missed the point entirely. The scammer tells the victim "Go to AnyDesk.com and hit the download button". That button is OS aware and downloads the correct installer. Then the victim runs it, and goes through the exact same OS agnostic setup steps. Done. Literally JUST tried this on Ubuntu and Pop!OS, as I said, and it worked.

I'm not even debating which OS is "more secure out of the box", or even which is more secure overall. I'm debating your constant misinformation and unwelcome BS in threads.
 
Eulogy said:
No, you missed the point entirely. The scammer tells the victim "Go to AnyDesk.com and hit the download button". That button is OS aware and downloads the correct installer. Then the victim runs it, and goes through the exact same OS agnostic setup steps. Done. Literally JUST tried this on Ubuntu and Pop!OS, as I said, and it worked.
Click to expand...
The only OS that's hard for this to install on is macOS. I've had to help older folks install this from the website, and having to explain to them how to go to system preferences to an add exception for the app in the security settings is sometimes next to impossible ... because they have to do it twice ... and once can take a half hour. Just explaining them how to install an app on macOS is in itself a task.
 
Shoganai said:
The only OS that's hard for this to install on is macOS. I've had to help older folks install this from the website, and having to explain to them how to go to system preferences to an add exception for the app in the security settings is sometimes next to impossible ... because they have to do it twice ... and once can take a half hour. Just explaining them how to install an app on macOS is in itself a task.
Click to expand...
I believe it. I have less experience with macOS and don't have any apple hardware to play around with. The bit of time I have spent with it (for my work), what you write sounds familiar. The last thing I had to do was write a driver for macOS 11, but, I didn't have to consider the end user experience for it at all :)
 
Eulogy said:
No, you missed the point entirely. The scammer tells the victim "Go to AnyDesk.com and hit the download button". That button is OS aware and downloads the correct installer. Then the victim runs it, and goes through the exact same OS agnostic setup steps. Done. Literally JUST tried this on Ubuntu and Pop!OS, as I said, and it worked.

I'm not even debating which OS is "more secure out of the box", or even which is more secure overall. I'm debating your constant misinformation and unwelcome BS in threads.
Click to expand...
No it doesn't.

The Anydesk site will direct the user to a Linux download page where you have to specify whether you're running Debian/Ubuntu/Mint (64 bit), Fedora 30/31/32 (64 bit), openSUSE 15/42 (64 bit), CentOS7 (64 bit), CentOS8 (64 bit), Red Hat Enterprise Linux 7 (64 bit), Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 (64 bit), Generic Linux (64 bit) or 'Other Versions'. You also have the option of adding the deb or rpm repository's.

Then you have the issue of Ubuntu refusing to install third party .deb's via it's software center - So the scammer has to instruct the victim how to install a deb via terminal.

So I'm sorry, but considering a user that thinks Windows 'is the computer' and thinks they're running 'Windows 9', your argument is fatally flawed.
 
Eulogy said:
I believe it. I have less experience with macOS and don't have any apple hardware to play around with. The bit of time I have spent with it (for my work), what you write sounds familiar. The last thing I had to do was write a driver for macOS 11, but, I didn't have to consider the end user experience for it at all :)
Click to expand...
I'm genuinely surprised by how many people don't know how to install apps on macOS. There are usually mounted DMG images all over the desktop because they launch the app from within the mounted DMG.
 
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