Comet Lake-S new socket LGA1200

Yup, but it didn't seem like it could happen again after AMD shit the bed with Bulldozer. I thought that was pretty much the death knell for AMD.
Well, Intel recovered after Netburst, so I don't see why AMD couldn't recover after Bulldozer - glad they did!
 
You've got to be pretty silly to buy Intel still
This new socket its all part of the " milking those suckers" grand plan CEO strategy. What a disgrace.
 
AMD has done 3 generations on the same socket will likely get one more in before there is a need to change it (likely for DDR5). That's the thing between the two companies. When AMD changes a socket there usually is a very explained reason. For Intel not so much.
 
AMD has done 3 generations on the same socket will likely get one more in before there is a need to change it (likely for DDR5). That's the thing between the two companies. When AMD changes a socket there usually is a very explained reason. For Intel not so much.

Intel likes to add imaginery pins to sell you new motherboard lol. They haven't learned that. Like 9900k wasn't burning 150+w already. Common! Hey release a new board, all power to you but allow people to use the chip in z390 atleast that support 9900k.
 
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It's stuff like this that led to my big gap in upgrading last time. From a 2600K to a 7700K. There's no real reason for me to upgrade. I'd say I'd get some other features from the new chipset, etc., but it's just marginal. Not anything to write home about.

Another delay for an upgrade. I'm definitely not hurting for an upgrade and doing pretty well with what I've got. I enjoy upgrading, though. I just want to get something significant out of it. Intel isn't bringing any significant gains with much lately.
 
I wonder what those [50 -- how the heck did I read "LGA1200" and see "LGA2000"???] new pins are going to be used for. I would imagine most of them will be NC so that next year, they can introduce 12 core CPUs, claim these need more power and thus another mess socket so that they can redefine 3% of them as moar voltage again.
 
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I wonder what those 850 new pins are going to be used for. I would imagine most of them will be NC so that next year, they can introduce 12 core CPUs, claim these need more power and thus another mess socket so that they can redefine 3% of them as moar voltage again.
TIL 1200 - 1150 = 850.


Therefore, Comet Lake-S processors will reportedly only fit into a motherboard with an LGA 1200 socket, 49 more pins than the existing LGA 1151 socket. As per usual, new motherboards give Intel the opportunity to introduce new chipset silicon, which in this case, is rumored to be the 400-series.
 
thesmokingman Intel has had so many basically identical sockets that I can't ever remember which is which.

lol so true...

1150
1151
1155
1156

Westmere
Sandy/Ivy Bridge
Haswell
Skylake

match them up, no cheating! good luck!

Not that AMD was massively better with AM2/AM2+/AM3/AM3+ but they at least had a large degree of forward/backward compatibility so one could more or less just toss a CPU in whatever, it just might miss some features
 
Not that I care that much for myself, since I have ZERO intention of upgrading in the same Motherboard.

But geez, it makes Intel look kind of incompetent when they can't run for 2 nearly identical CPU generations in a row, without a MB upgrade. You would think when they were upgrading Power deliver or whatever for Coffee Lake, they could have thought, just maybe we give a little extra headroom for 10 cores....
 
While Intel does release more sockets than it probably needs to, the frequent changes have the benefit of preventing allot of the headaches you encounter with AMD's platforms. You don't typically need old CPU's to flash the BIOS, you don't have the same level of memory compatibility problems, or motherboards that support certain processors with XYZ TDP and not others, etc.
 
or go ryzen...

Which will need a new motherboard. And when you decide to upgrade it there will likely be another motherboard. AM4 has 1 possibly 2 more CPU releases total.

You may want to wait till DDR5 & PCIe5 hits mainstream.
 
While Intel does release more sockets than it probably needs to, the frequent changes have the benefit of preventing allot of the headaches you encounter with AMD's platforms. You don't typically need old CPU's to flash the BIOS, you don't have the same level of memory compatibility problems, or motherboards that support certain processors with XYZ TDP and not others, etc.

BIOS updates for microcode compatibility were a major drawback for me, but now with wider adoption of "USB BIOS flashback" features, it's gradually becoming a thing of the past. I'm now running two Ryzen 3700X rigs between my dad and I, and neither have our chosen memory kits on their respective QVL lists, so I'm finding that more minor than I anticipated.
 
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Which will need a new motherboard. And when you decide to upgrade it there will likely be another motherboard. AM4 has 1 possibly 2 more CPU releases total.

You may want to wait till DDR5 & PCIe5 hits mainstream.
Not counting the existing 3 release cycles, that's till 1-2 more than Intel systems. :).
 
Not counting the existing 3 release cycles, that's till 1-2 more than Intel systems. :).

Agreed but it does not help a user wanting to upgrade in 2019 or 2020 to either platform from something that is incompatible.
 
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Agreed but it does not help a user wanting to upgrade in 2019 or 2020 to either platform from something that is incompatible.
I meant even if it has 1 left that's 1 more than Intel has left, and pcie 4.0 for the 570, so it should age better as nvme and GPUs get faster.
 
I meant even if it has 1 left that's 1 more than Intel has left, and pcie 4.0 for the 570, so it should age better as nvme and GPUs get faster.

Except GPU today aren't saturating PCIe 3.0 and I expect by the time PCIe 3.0 fully saturated by a GPU, PCIe 5.0 would be out. I say having PCIe 4.0 benefits NVMe due to additional bandwidth but your average user will not notice it.
 
Except GPU today aren't saturating PCIe 3.0 and I expect by the time PCIe 3.0 fully saturated by a GPU, PCIe 5.0 would be out. I say having PCIe 4.0 benefits NVMe due to additional bandwidth but your average user will not notice it.
Very true, however, even if pcie 5 is out, GPUs probably won't be saturating pcie 4 yet, so when they start saturating 3, the move to 4 will be just as good as 5, until they can saturate 4, which will be a 'long' time. I do agree, most wouldn't notice, but again, it's a more future proof solution than pcie 3.
 
Except GPU today aren't saturating PCIe 3.0 and I expect by the time PCIe 3.0 fully saturated by a GPU, PCIe 5.0 would be out. I say having PCIe 4.0 benefits NVMe due to additional bandwidth but your average user will not notice it.

Average users don't even know what pcie is so that's not for them.
 
BIOS updates for microcode compatibility were a major drawback for me, but now with wider adoption of "USB BIOS flashback" features, it's gradually becoming a thing of the past. I'm now running two Ryzen 3700X rigs between my dad and I, and neither have our chosen memory kits on their respective QVL lists, so I'm finding that more minor than I anticipated.

The other side of things is that as more Ryzen systems are out there, you might find someone local who has one. I know I left a 2600 in my mother's computer in case I ever need to flash a processor.

I kind of wish that AMD would allow full backward compatibility with newer chipsets back to 1st gen processors. It seems like it is more a manufacturing issue to limit bios size rather than a physical reason why it wouldn't work with X570. The 4XX chipsets turn into more versatile ones as they can accept both backward and forward as long as the correct bios is loaded.

Intel completely turned me off with their Z270 chipset. It didn't even have a 8 month useful life before it was updated to Z370 for no reason. In fact, Z370 when you run it through the Intel support download center sees it as a 200 series chipset :banghead:
 
The other side of things is that as more Ryzen systems are out there, you might find someone local who has one. I know I left a 2600 in my mother's computer in case I ever need to flash a processor.

I kind of wish that AMD would allow full backward compatibility with newer chipsets back to 1st gen processors. It seems like it is more a manufacturing issue to limit bios size rather than a physical reason why it wouldn't work with X570. The 4XX chipsets turn into more versatile ones as they can accept both backward and forward as long as the correct bios is loaded.

The reason for the limited BIOS size is simply about cost savings.
 
The reason for the limited BIOS size is simply about cost savings.

I know. That's what I meant to say in a round about way. I did see the new MSI boards have larger bioses to accommodate the various CPU's (Max series I believe).

At some level, how much could a 32MB ROM cost vs a 16MB one? I get that MB manufacturing is extremely competitive, but some of these boards are $350+. An extra dollar isn't going to kill anyone.
 
I know. That's what I meant to say in a round about way. I did see the new MSI boards have larger bioses to accommodate the various CPU's (Max series I believe).

At some level, how much could a 32MB ROM cost vs a 16MB one? I get that MB manufacturing is extremely competitive, but some of these boards are $350+. An extra dollar isn't going to kill anyone.
It's not as if AMD didn't make it known in advance they we're sticking to the AM4 platform for a while, so MB manufacturers knew. It's just nobody at the time (people buying) knew how much space each xpu would take so there was nobody seeking out mb's with larger a BIOS.
 
I know. That's what I meant to say in a round about way. I did see the new MSI boards have larger bioses to accommodate the various CPU's (Max series I believe).

At some level, how much could a 32MB ROM cost vs a 16MB one? I get that MB manufacturing is extremely competitive, but some of these boards are $350+. An extra dollar isn't going to kill anyone.

It's roughly twice as much. That's around $4-$5. That doesn't sound like a big deal, but over thousands and thousands of motherboards, it is. The margin on these things are much leaner than you'd think. This is also not a problem on the more expensive boards which do have higher margins. It's a problem at the sub-$300 price point where they are lean as hell.
 
I know. That's what I meant to say in a round about way. I did see the new MSI boards have larger bioses to accommodate the various CPU's (Max series I believe).

At some level, how much could a 32MB ROM cost vs a 16MB one? I get that MB manufacturing is extremely competitive, but some of these boards are $350+. An extra dollar isn't going to kill anyone.

The CPU micro code seems to take up a very small percentage of the bios space. It is mostly the UI that is what uses the space I am guessing.

Case in point: the B350 bios actually got smaller as they added Zen 2 support and dropped Bristol Ridge. I can't imagine a 16 MB bios being the issue for the various Skylake versions.

For the LGA 1200 boards, they will most likely have a 32 MB bios though.
 
And so what? We shouldn't want pcie 4?
It's not just about a single thing either. An 8x pcie 4.0 is just as fast as a 16x 3.0... this means you can run 2x8 GPUs without losing any performance, or MB makers *could* do things like 4 pcie x2, instead of 2x 4... Not always about a single item.
 
Slightly different companies, market position and cash reserves.
Yep, and AMD is currently the only one truly innovating x86_64 without making the security of their processors into Swiss cheese.
 
Yep, and AMD is currently the only one truly innovating x86_64 without making the security of their processors into Swiss cheese.

That remains to be seen. We won't really know how secure AMD's CPU's are for several years.
 
That remains to be seen. We won't really know how secure AMD's CPU's are for several years.
Why do you think it would take several years?
There have been 20+ hardware exploits that Intel x86_64 CPUs are/were vulnerable to, most of which AMD x86_64 CPUs are not.
 
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