Apple Loses Patent Retrial To VirnetX, Owes $302.4M

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It looks like it is time for Apple to start digging in its couch cushions to pay VirnetX over $300 million for patent infringement. Apple still faces another court hearing to determine whether or not it willfully infringed the patents.


A jury in 2012 awarded $368.2 million in damages, but the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit in Washington, D.C., partly overturned that verdict, saying there were problems with how the trial judge instructed jurors on calculating damages. On remand, VirnetX's two suits were combined, and in February, a jury returned with an even bigger verdict, $625.6 million, one of the highest ever in a U.S. patent case. In the latest trial, jurors were asked to determine damages on two VirnetX patents that Apple had already been found to infringe, and to determine both infringement and damages on another two patents. The $302.4 million award was in line with what VirnetX had been demanding.
 
Sounds like VirtenX is a sort of patent troll as they have expanded their patent holdings to be able to go after other companies after the fact.

Also sounds like Apple was willfully infringing on said patents.

So two scummy companies going at it. Not surprised one bit.

VirnetX - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
This is what a company like Apple does. They find tech/software/firmware that will do what they want, find if a patent exists, if it does then they reverse it, incorporate it, and then wait for a lawsuit that they can fight and generally win. It's cheaper this way to try and bury a company under legal debt or settle for a lower cost than it would have been to buy it out outright.
 
It looks like it is time for Apple to start digging in its couch cushions to pay VirnetX over $300 million for patent infringement. Apple still faces another court hearing to determine whether or not it willfully infringed the patents.


A jury in 2012 awarded $368.2 million in damages, but the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit in Washington, D.C., partly overturned that verdict, saying there were problems with how the trial judge instructed jurors on calculating damages. On remand, VirnetX's two suits were combined, and in February, a jury returned with an even bigger verdict, $625.6 million, one of the highest ever in a U.S. patent case. In the latest trial, jurors were asked to determine damages on two VirnetX patents that Apple had already been found to infringe, and to determine both infringement and damages on another two patents. The $302.4 million award was in line with what VirnetX had been demanding.
"Apple fails to overturn VirnetX patent verdict, could owe over $1.1 billion" -- https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-virnetx-idUSKBN29K2DU
 
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Good. Take em for all they are worth. Apple is a scummy company.
Lets see what their patent manager has to say about that.
child-labor-in-foxconn-apple-did-not-inform-me.jpg
 
Apple is a scummy company.

So is VirnetX. They're a patent troll, the majority of their revenue comes from litigation over their patent portfolio, rather than actual marketable products. Their website looks like something a college student would make for a web design class, and their "Gabriel" platform looks like a generic communication app any competent programmer could make in short order. They probably made it just so their patents couldn't be invalidated for not using them.

It also seems like VirnetX likes to file lawsuits in the East Texas district, despite them being in Nevada and Apple being in California. East Texas is well known for patent troll litigation, but rules changed a few years ago, so that may be winding down.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/a...-texas-town-that-patent-trolls-built-j34rlmjc
 
It's fucking sad people have this opinion.
Why is it sad that people have an opinion on a company that has questionable relationships & business practices? If anything an opinion like mine should be more common & welcomed rather than just accepting these companies for what they are or have become. They should have the spotlight on them.
 
It's pretty apt to me.

Apple is the king of consumer unfriendly decisions and what's worse is other companies hop on board.

The real shame is it's only 1.1 billion. Now they'll only have 998.9 billion in the bank.
Buy something else if you don't like them. Supporting antiquated courtrooms and patent systems literally eff's our whole country. Stunning people can't see that.
 
Why is it sad that people have an opinion on a company that has questionable relationships & business practices? If anything an opinion like mine should be more common & welcomed rather than just accepting these companies for what they are or have become. They should have the spotlight on them.
It stifles the hell out of innovation. I don't give a crap if you like apple or not, that isn't really the issue here.
 
It stifles the hell out of innovation. I don't give a crap if you like apple or not, that isn't really the issue here.
How so? Apple is the only one who can innovate? Seems to me that Apple doesn't innovate according the the theme of the post. As a matter of fact, Apple hasn't really come up with any of their own idea's since the original Macintosh, and even that's a stretch.

Putting more camera's on a phone is not an innovation.
 
Why is it sad that people have an opinion on a company that has questionable relationships & business practices? If anything an opinion like mine should be more common, rather than just accepting these companies for what they are or have become. They should have the spotlight on them.
The issue I take with this is that if you're going to make these statement you need to be logically consistent. And frankly people aren't.
The fact that you're able to even post on this forum means you're supporting scummy companies. I've brought this up multiple times. Every electronic device you use with an IC in it was built on slave labor, and human rights violations (and theft, lets not forget theft). It's all rare earth minerals and things manufactured in China. Which is a bit redundant to say, because both of those more or less involve racing to the bottom and terrible business practices.

It seems to me you're mad at Apple because they're currently the most successful at it. But again, to be logically consistent you should care and be shaking a stick at every company doing these things but you aren't. Apple is being used as your scape goat, and for whatever reason it's okay for every other company to do those things, but not Apple. Because we hate them.
 
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The issue I take with this is that if you're going to make these statement you need to be logically consistent. And frankly people aren't.
The fact that you're able to even post on this forum means you're supporting scummy companies. I've brought this up multiple times. Every electronic device you use with an IC in it was built on slave labor, and human rights violations (and theft, lets not forget theft). It's all rare earth minerals and things manufactured in China. Which is a bit redundant to say, because both of those more or less involve racing to the bottom and terrible business practices.

It seems to me you're mad at Apple because they're currently the most successful at it. But again, to be logically consistent you should care and be shaking a stick at every company doing these things but you aren't.
And you think I don't know that? The important thing is that we DO know that. But other than sending smoke signals to each other, how would you suggest we communicate over the internet with each other?

I guess we just chalk it up to the price of progress eh? Like a dead animal on the road...
 
How so? Apple is the only one who can innovate? Seems to me that Apple doesn't innovate according the the theme of the post. As a matter of fact, Apple hasn't really come up with any of their own idea's since the original Macintosh, and even that's a stretch.

Putting more camera's on a phone is not an innovation.
These companies don't just sue apple, they sue everyone, even poor solo developers.

But sure... the OG mac lol...

https://www.androidpolice.com/2020/...-prototype-phone-but-youd-never-recognize-it/
 
And you don't think I know that? The important thing is that we DO know that. But other than sending smoke signals to each other, how would you suggest we communicate over the internet with each other?

I guess we just chalk it up to the price of progress eh? Like a dead animal on the road...
In terms of this conversation - my only "demand" is logical consistency. If you're going to hate on Apple you should be shitting in basically every other company based thread as well and be rooting for them all to burn. If you're indifferent to all the other companies - you should be just as indifferent towards Apple. That's basically it.
Otherwise the position is either illogical at best or hypocritical at worst.
 
In terms of this conversation - my only "demand" is logical consistency. If you're going to hate on Apple you should be shitting in basically every other company based thread as well and be rooting for them all to burn. If you're indifferent to all the other companies - you should be just as indifferent towards Apple. That's basically it.
Otherwise the position is either illogical at best or hypocritical at worst.
Oh I understand. We as consumers are in a very bad position, those of us that think about these types of things, especially the ones who like technology. We have to pick our battles, and that's the sad thing. We know these companies do evil things, we know these countries (China) run concentration camps. I'm not indifferent about it. Its almost gotten to the point for me where I don't even want to purchase technology any longer.

But really, we don't have a choice.
 
Oh I understand. We as consumers are in a very bad position, those of us that think about these types of things, especially the ones who like technology. We have to pick our battles, and that's the sad thing. We know these companies do evil things, we know these countries (China) run concentration camps. I'm not indifferent about it. Its almost gotten to the point for me where I don't even want to purchase technology any longer.
I guess?

Is Apple perfect? No. But as far as a lot of the things they do they're a lot better than a lot of companies if your whole standpoint is to pick "the least evil". They have some of the best environmental practices and recycling practices. And I get why people look at them and believe the worst - but I actually do think they have made attempts to make working conditions better as well as pay. Still terrible and well below any developed country? Sure, but making a wage that those same individuals couldn't get otherwise? - Very likely.
Security and Privacy are also two fronts which are probably the things they're stepping forward the most which are the absolute best for the consumer. Especially considering all the Google data harvesting (eg: Android phones/Google services) and Windows Telemetry (that you can't turn off). We may not see eye to eye about which "violations" are the worst, or which compromises are the "best", but I think it's not a hard argument to state that Apple isn't at the bottom of the heap even if you don't believe they're at the top.
 
I swear that looks familiar, like it's a rebadge of something else. I thought "BlackJack II" at first, but I looked up the pictures of that and it's not.
It looks like a Google-ized version of a Blackberry or Palm. Which of course is what they wanted to copy before the iPhone was announced. Perhaps an 8520? Maybe even a Treo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treo_755p
Seems like it's looks very similar to devices from Palm and Blackberry at the time.
 
It looks like a Google-ized version of a Blackberry or Palm. Which of course is what they wanted to copy before the iPhone was announced. Perhaps an 8520? Maybe even a Treo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treo_755p
Seems like it's looks very similar to devices from Palm and Blackberry at the time.
Could be. There's something about the shape of the button bar over the keyboard--and the keys themselves--that screams Samsung to me, but I dunno.
 
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