4 Generations at the same time?

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wandplus

Limp Gawd
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Jan 14, 2020
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Comet Lake, Rocket Lake, Alder Lake & Raptor Lake selling at the same time. Have you seen this before?

Only thing is, I read Meteor Lake is delayed. 🌌
 
If you look at the overall architecture, there is no huge advancement in CPU technology that really separates these. They are all fairly minor evolutionary advancements over the previous generation.

For a comparable example, there were actually 4 generations of the Pentium 4. You had Willamette, Northwood, Prescott, and Cedar Mill. Make that 6 if you count the Netburst-based Pentium-D CPUs (Smithfield and Presler).
 
GotNoRice said:
If you look at the overall architecture, there is no huge advancement in CPU technology that really separates these. They are all fairly minor evolutionary advancements over the previous generation.

For a comparable example, there were actually 4 generations of the Pentium 4. You had Willamette, Northwood, Prescott, and Cedar Mill. Make that 6 if you count the Netburst-based Pentium-D CPUs (Smithfield and Presler).
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Willamette was hot garbage. All of netburst was really.
 
GotNoRice said:
If you look at the overall architecture, there is no huge advancement in CPU technology that really separates these. They are all fairly minor evolutionary advancements over the previous generation.

For a comparable example, there were actually 4 generations of the Pentium 4. You had Willamette, Northwood, Prescott, and Cedar Mill. Make that 6 if you count the Netburst-based Pentium-D CPUs (Smithfield and Presler).
Click to expand...

I don't know if I'd agree. ADL and RPL are a lot different due to their big little CPUs and first major architecture change since skylake.
 
Alder Lake is vastly ahead of the hot garbage that was Rocket Lake and Comet Lake, between higher clocks and higher IPC a $99 ADL i3 is faster than a last gen i5 and games like an i7.

RKL fills capacity on the 14nm lines which aren't useful for high end parts, it beats using them to fab chipsets because you get $300 per die instead of $30.
 
wandplus said:
Comet Lake, Rocket Lake, Alder Lake & Raptor Lake selling at the same time. Have you seen this before?

Only thing is, I read Meteor Lake is delayed. 🌌
Click to expand...
Raptor lake is almost double the single core score in Cinibench R23, compared to Comet Lake.
 
MrGuvernment said:
I owned one of those :( and shortly after realized my mistake and got a Northwood C, think that was when my real overclocking career started.
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I still have one. It was my dad's and bought during that brief period between P3 being discontinued and Northwood coming out (I have one of those, too). I was surprised the tiny HP cooler on it worked so well. Made a decent Linux learning box.
 
bwang said:
Alder Lake is vastly ahead of the hot garbage that was Rocket Lake and Comet Lake, between higher clocks and higher IPC a $99 ADL i3 is faster than a last gen i5 and games like an i7.

RKL fills capacity on the 14nm lines which aren't useful for high end parts, it beats using them to fab chipsets because you get $300 per die instead of $30.
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It's insane, but you're right. The i3-12100 is actually slightly faster overall than the i5-11400F I bought this summer:

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-11400F-vs-Intel-Core-i3-12100/4111vs4126
CPUGamingDesktopServerOverall Rank
i5-11400F94%96%85%70th/1,372
i3-1210094%101%80%68th/1,372

I guess that I should have ditched Shuttle and built an LGA 1700 system. Oh well, I guess I can still upgrade to an i9-11900KF in a few years when they are cheap and least get something that somewhat resembles a midrange 12th gen CPU.

Just a question: was Intel 11th gen (Rocket Lake) ever regarded as being a quality line of CPU's or was it basically dead-on-arrival like the old Intel Prescott's when AMD was kicking Intel's butts with the Athlon 64's? Am I the one sucker on this board that actually went and bought one?
 
gvx64 said:
It's insane, but you're right. The i3-12100 is actually slightly faster overall than the i5-11400F I bought this summer:

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-11400F-vs-Intel-Core-i3-12100/4111vs4126
CPUGamingDesktopServerOverall Rank
i5-11400F94%96%85%70th/1,372
i3-1210094%101%80%68th/1,372

I guess that I should have ditched Shuttle and built an LGA 1700 system. Oh well, I guess I can still upgrade to an i9-11900KF in a few years when they are cheap and least get something that somewhat resembles a midrange 12th gen CPU.

Just a question: was Intel 11th gen (Rocket Lake) ever regarded as being a quality line of CPU's or was it basically dead-on-arrival like the old Intel Prescott's when AMD was kicking Intel's butts with the Athlon 64's? Am I the one sucker on this board that actually went and bought one?
Click to expand...
Pretty much, sometimes that's just the way it goes unfortunately
 
I don't think anyone is a sucker for buying a Comet Lake or Rocket Lake. Those still use cheaper 3200MHz RAM and some of those CPUs are going for very good sale prices lately. If I'm correct, Intel announced in the last few months that they raised their prices 10% twice (the second raise announced just yesterday). I suspect some people will be going for i3 CPUs just for that reason.

I have machines with Rocket Lake and Comet Lake CPUs and only want to upgrade once I see either Meteor Lake or Lunar Lake CPUs with ATX 3.0 PSUs, Gen 5 SSDs and cases with USB 5.0 and hopefully USB-C. Alder Lake and Raptor Lake from what I know work better with Windows 11 and for the first few months they were coming out with patches to sort the bugs. I don't really like to buy the "latest and greatest" for that reason alone. I'll likely wait until 9 months passes before I get a new platform given the crap I went through with slightly defective B560 motherboards I bought. (Both B560 mobos I bought later worked well. So I'll end up with one being used for a sort test machine and another used as a surveillance system).
 
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gvx64 said:
It's insane, but you're right. The i3-12100 is actually slightly faster overall than the i5-11400F I bought this summer:

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-11400F-vs-Intel-Core-i3-12100/4111vs4126
CPUGamingDesktopServerOverall Rank
i5-11400F94%96%85%70th/1,372
i3-1210094%101%80%68th/1,372

I guess that I should have ditched Shuttle and built an LGA 1700 system. Oh well, I guess I can still upgrade to an i9-11900KF in a few years when they are cheap and least get something that somewhat resembles a midrange 12th gen CPU.

Just a question: was Intel 11th gen (Rocket Lake) ever regarded as being a quality line of CPU's or was it basically dead-on-arrival like the old Intel Prescott's when AMD was kicking Intel's butts with the Athlon 64's? Am I the one sucker on this board that actually went and bought one?
Click to expand...
Rocket Lake is totally fine-----if you compartmentalize a bit.

It had 2 big problems:

1. It maxed out at 8 cores. So.....couldn't even come close to touching Zen 3 in multicore work. Let alone Zen 2...

2. Ignoring core counts----Zen 3 is still pretty much strictly better. Rocket Lake isn't super far behind or something. But, it really only sort of meets Zen 3 on some performance metrics.

Another smaller negative is: since it was late to the game with PCIe 4.0 support (Zen 3 is AMD's second generation supporting PCIe 4.0) -----Intel should have allowed more than 1 PCIe 4.0 drive.

However, it does have AV1 decode on the iGPU. Decodes all variations of H.265 (so its great for video editing, especially in Davinci Resolve). And it has AVX512, which is cool for RPCS3.
I had an 11700 non-k in an ITX system and thought it was solid. I was also able to get that CPU for only $200 right after release, due to a generous coupon from Staples customer service, which I stacked with a promo code.
 
I just thought that I would share this breakdown that I compiled from https://cpu.userbenchmark.com. I was just trying to get a better feel for the 10th-13th generation and what kind of performance leaps occurred.

Budget:
CPUGamingDesktopWorkstationOverall Rank
i3-9100F81%87%61%80.6% (170th/1376)
i3-10100F80%85%66%80.4% (175th/1376)
-----
i3-12100F94%101%80%94.2% (74th/1376)
i3-13100F97%103%83%96.6% (62nd/1376)

Lower Mid-range
CPUGamingDesktopWorkstationOverall Rank
i5-9400F85%87%69%84.8% (135th/1376)
i5-10400F85%87%76%85.2% (129th/1376)
i5-11400F94%96%85%94.1% (75th/1376)
i5-12400F98%102%92%98.4% (49th/1376)
i5-13400F105%108%105%105% (29th/1376)

Upper Mid-range
CPUGamingDesktopWorkstationOverall Rank
i7-970092%92%83%92% (89th/1376)
i7-1070093%94%90%92.6% (85th/1376)
i7-1170098%100%96%98.2% (52nd/1376)
i7-12700107%108%117%107% (27th/1376)
i7-13700120%120%145%120% (10th/1376)

High-end
CPUGamingDesktopWorkstationOverall Rank
i9-9900KF98%98%97%97.8% (55th/1376)
i9-10900KF99%100%106%99.5% (42nd/1376)
i9-11900KF103%105%103%103% (33rd/1376)
i9-12900KF118%118%140%118% (11th/1376)
i9-13900KF129%128%171%129% (3rd/1376)

At the lower-mid-range end it really looks to me like the weak generation in the group is the Comet Lake (10th gen). The i3-10100F is actually slower in benchmarks than the i3-9100F which blows me away. Actually, within the i5-lineup, the i5-11400F actually has the biggest jump gen-on-gen that we see: I would certainly characterize the Comet Lake i5-10400F as being the weakest link in the i5 series above. The i5 12th and 13th gen (while boasting impressive improvements) does not even show the same degree of improvements that we see between the i5-11400F and the i5-10400F. It's in the high-end line-up where we really start seeing the 12th and 13th gen move away from the generations that came before it (probably because of the e-cores, I am guessing). At the high-end, the i9-11900KF really doesn't show much of an improvement over the i9-10900KF or i9-9900KF, while the i9-12900KF and i9-13900KF completely breaks away from the pack. I assume that it is the higher-end line-up with its e-cores and p-cores where we really start to see the true power of the 12th and 13th gen come into play.

So yeah, I guess I feel a bit better about things. The i5-11400F certainly isn't at the level of the 12th and 13th gen but it is a heck of a lot better than the i5-10400F and had some pretty impressive gen-on-gen improvement. Yes, the i3-12100F is faster than the i5-11400F but if there was an i3-11100F (there isn't) I do believe that it, in turn, would have been considerably faster than the i5-10400F. Where the 11th gen is the weakest is at the high-end 11900KF chip, but aside from this I would characterize the 10th gen as being the weakest out of the 4 in terms of generational improvement.
 
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